Bible/come to Jesus

[WoleverEntun]

Such as when King John offered England as a papal fief to curry favour with the pope.

 

[Ostadar]

As I stated before, and this relates to everything involving religion and faith -- it is all up to interpretation. The message and lessons people try to convey through various types of communication(for example: writing, speech, body language) can be misinterpreted by the person who receives the message so that the original context was lost.

Over hundreds of years societies change and the message within printed words can received in vastly different ways. Cultural differences also can skew the internal/mental meaning of the words that are read or heard. The act of growing from a child to an adult with different experiences as another person causes messages to be interpreted in different ways.

So now I state. Why are those of you who are doing so blaming an idea, something that can't by itself do any harm or violence. Religion is not an entity, it does not have appendages, it can not hold a sword or a gun. It can not rend flesh or break bone. It can not kill or cause war. Only people can do that. And people are stupid. If you want to blame something blame stupid people who just used it as an excuse.

 

[Carlover1234]

I think this discussion should end. Lets face it, everyone has their own beliefs and religion. None of these religions are wrong, they are just different. There is no better religion either. So please stop bringing this to the internet and Herocraft!!!!

 

[MultiHeartGold]

I think this discussion should end. Lets face it, everyone has their own beliefs and religion. None of these religions are wrong, they are just different. There is no better religion either. So please stop bringing this to the internet and Herocraft!!!!

You arent forced to click the thread. Whenever you click a thread about religions or politics, you should be expecting a mind explosion.

 

[Sniped105]

Quite the amount of attention this has gotten. Might as well weigh in on here!

Religion to me is strange. I am a confirmed Christian but I do not acknowledge that in my daily life. You could argue that I am atheist , but I would prefer to say I'm more or less curious. Personally I like to look at life through a "scientific" point of view, going by the big bang theory and the logic behind it, why weather happens bla bla bla. But I don't doubt the views of religion and how the bible tells of the worlds creation or why things happen. I don't hate religion, theres plenty of great moral values in there. For instance, one of the ten commandments : thou shalt not commit adultery. Causes plenty of issues, makes you an asshole, something good to avoid doing I say. A topic like this is a two headed coin.

Bassically to sum that mess of rambling up I'm curious in both aspects ; religion vs science (for lack of a better word). I like to think and question but I do not shun others with different beliefs than mine. As far as I can tell though, since I am not fully "accepting the lord as my savior" that makes me not worthy of heaven? Even if I cured cancer, ended world hunger and fixed the severely increasing pollution problem. That's what messes me up. If god put me on this earth, and is all knowing and all seeing, why should I be punished for using the brain and intellectual level he gave me? For thinking outside of religion and looking into my own ideas of how everything started. To me it almost seems as if it is an elitist sort of thing. If you don't match every requirement, you go to hell and suffer. Doesn't really click very well in my opinion.

Just my input! I do respect you're views of god and by all means if you feel a connection and really believe in it, don't let anyone else tell you different!

 

[Faunherer]

I personally don't believe in the Science vs. Religion debate. Neither one disproves the other. Science may disprove parts of the Bible if you read it literally, but it does not disprove Christianity. You have to remember that the Bible was written by people in a time where our understanding of the natural world was far more primitive. People needed to know why things happened, so they created stories. You can read and interpret the Bible however you'd like, but it still is a guide to life for many people.

 

[Minerjoesdog]

Love what you're doing bob. You have my support, God bless you.

 

[Sniped105]

I personally don't believe in the Science vs. Religion debate. Neither one disproves the other. Science may disprove parts of the Bible if you read it literally, but it does not disprove Christianity. You have to remember that the Bible was written by people in a time where our understanding of the natural world was far more primitive. People needed to know why things happened, so they created stories. You can read and interpret the Bible however you'd like, but it still is a guide to life for many people.

What I mean is they go against each other. If you ask a scientist how the earth was formed they would explain the big bang theory to you. If you asked a priest or a Christian follower, it would pertain to God creating everything. Hence the debate.

 

[Faunherer]

What I mean is they go against each other. If you ask a scientist how the earth was formed they would explain the big bang theory to you. If you asked a priest or a Christian follower, it would pertain to God creating everything. Hence the debate.

The big bang theory is not a creation theory, it is a theory explaining why the universe is how it is now, and why celestial bodies are moving. It is a rapid expansion theory and it does not explain the creation of what we know of as the 'universe'.

 

[Psychokhaos]

Meh, anyways should probably tag TheMormon to this thread. He is the Mormon expert here xD

Since this thread was revived I guess I have some stuff to say, especially as I have been thinking a lot about life and God and religion these past few months when I was really depressed and stuff.

Most of you seem to forget a vital part of all of us, that we are not puppets. We have freewill which, being as we are, turn into excuses to corrupt and destroy. The half of you that do not follow god blame him for things which you don't even believe in.

They don't blame the being, they blame the people that follow it all to extremes. Big difference there.

(Going to hold off swearing, but only becuase I feel it would be disrespectful towards bob_de_blastoise 's post, also I have no spell check on this computer, so I will be misspelling a good number of words.)

Look, I can see this is up to 20 pages, and at first I was suprisingly impressed how mature the first couple of posts were, but I didn't make it through the first page before the smart-alecks started going off.

Regardless what you believe, whether it be science, god, jedism, or fairies, you all need to learn that in the end, it really doesn't matter.

Now, I have been the asshole athiest, judging people for being "foolish enough to believe such crap". As I grew older, I began to see things as they really were. Religion might seem silly to some of us, but do you know what they have that we don't? Faith. Hope. An optimistic end to look forward. I grew to envy that, becuase the thought that one day I would be nothing was hard to bare. Seriously, imagine not existing, being forgotten, never to be thought of again. The likelyhood of any of our names being remembered in history is slim to none.

The point I am trying to make is, going out of your way to point at the flaws of another's religious beliefs is petty. Its nothing more then trying to prove how right you think you are. It is one thing to have a philisophical debate about religion and beliefs and its another to ask stupid questions just to make a point. One is an intelligent conversation, the other is just being a jerk for the sake of it.

Before you continue to post here, please think about what it is you are going to say, are you saying it becuase you are truely curious? Then reword it to make sure what you are saying is n't taken as an attack. If you just want to bash on Christianity, why bother? What do you really get out of that?

Remember, just becuase 1 person did soemthing stupid in the name of a religion, does not mean that everyone of that religion is guilty of that crime.

bob_de_blastoise, You were brave to post your beliefs here, I hope the community hasn't been too harsh.

Sincerely,
Micheal, the Jedi.


P.S.

You CANNOT make someone believe in your religion. That is something each person must do themselves. Trying to prove others that their beliefs are wrong and that yours are better is just as petty as attacking anothers beliefs to be a pain.

You have no idea how much I agree with stuff that you post.

Will finish going through the recent parts of the thread recently, going to my sister's choir concert.

 

[Acherous]

Please, give examples on how Faunherer is wrong. Otherwise your statement has nothing to back it up and is just derogatory banter targeted at him.

One specific example is creationism. Science has proven evolution. Another, the bible states the earth is ~6000 years old. Science has also proven that to be false. I can think of a few others but you get the point. I'm not going to write a wall of text.

 

[Ostadar]

One specific example is creationism. Science has proven evolution. Another, the bible states the earth is ~6000 years old. Science has also proven that to be false. I can think of a few others but you get the point. I'm not going to write a wall of text.

In truth, Creationism has very few conflicts with evolutionism and various scientific theories on the beginnings of the universe; such as the Big Bang. To start with the Bible never states that the Earth is ~6000 years old, that is just people(Humans) trying to put a timeline to a set of events in a book with no dates. Secondly it is stated that God is not beholden to the concept of Time that man is. A Day to the christian God could be millions of years while he shapes and observes the Universe and it's expansion, or that Day could be the very infinitesimally small moment in which the Universe starts it's expansion(the Big Bang).

It does need to be taken into account as well that time exists as a dimension that we live in. If the human mind was capable of not going completely insane from it and then die from it, we could observe every moment of our life all at once and control what happens within that period of Time. Much as the christian God who is eternal and omniscient.

It could be considered a form of time travel, but only within the scope of your lifetime and it would be instantaneous.

 

[TheMrLief]

Science may disprove parts of the Bible if you read it literally, but it does not disprove Christianity.

The Bible is pretty much what 75% of Christianity is based on, if the book has faults or gets disproven the whole thing pretty much just collapses in on itself. When the book was written it was meant to be taken literally, lets be honest whats more likely, a bunch of uneducated jews wrote a really symbolic book to influence people or a really literal book to influence people? Christianity just keeps trying to adapt to modern times so it doesn't die off by altering their beliefs.

 

[Barnubus]

Spoiler: Has nothing to do with Christianity

But still a pretty cool idea.

 

[HelsEch]

Spoiler: Has nothing to do with Christianity

But still a pretty cool idea.

Spoiler: Has nothing to do with Christianity

I must admit, Buddhism is probably one of my favorite religions to look at from the outside perspective. It's a code of morals where, instead of making worship a condition, it's left to be a genuine act of gratitude for the good these beliefs have done for them. Instead of bowing to deities you merely aspire to be the best you can be with no strings attached. This also allows it to be very malleable without having major divides like more rigid religions. If I cared more I might become a Buddhist, but overall I'm fine as I am.

 

[Psychokhaos]

Since this thread was revived I guess I have some stuff to say, especially as I have been thinking a lot about life and God and religion these past few months when I was really depressed and stuff.

They don't blame the being, they blame the people that follow it all to extremes. Big difference there.

You have no idea how much I agree with stuff that you post.

Will finish going through the recent parts of the thread recently, going to my sister's choir concert.

Continuing;

Part of what Faunherer says is true, in that science and religion can work together. They just may not have understood it as science, and thus in those days it would be common to go to a higher power for an explanation, or think of it as a magic/miracle of sorts. Theoretically, God could just have a higher knowledge of science, the Universe, and space-time and how to manipulate and use them. With this, I have always thought of it as God's time is different than mankind's, as what we use was made by us as a system of order.

Personally, I'm glad that I was raised Mormon. It has made me who I am, and helped with the development of my values and thoughts and beliefs of the world. As far as having a lot of faith in that God is real, or the Church is true, that's a no for me. After having been through some things, and knowing some things that have happened through history, I can find it hard to believe.

I recognize that I don't know for certain that there is or isn't a God out there, but I find it really hard to believe that, now that I've thought about it more and more these past few months. But I use what I have to go off of.

 

[Fjordsen]

The lack of any evidence that God excists vs. The theories that disproves religion that has solid evidence to back it up.

Obviously someone who are given a choice to believe in either of those would choose the second. However you christians can't give up on your dying religion, so you simply adapt your religion to fit with modern science. I mean come on, science alreadt disproved you during the rennessance, but you just burnt all the scientists at stakes.

About that moral thing, I have to disagree. All humans should know with themselves no matter what belief that they shouldn't steal, murder etc.

 

[Ostadar]

The lack of any evidence that God excists vs. The theories that disproves religion that has solid evidence to back it up.

Obviously someone who are given a choice to believe in either of those would choose the second. However you christians can't give up on your dying religion, so you simply adapt your religion to fit with modern science. I mean come on, science alreadt disproved you during the rennessance, but you just burnt all the scientists at stakes.

About that moral thing, I have to disagree. All humans should know with themselves no matter what belief that they shouldn't steal, murder etc.

• One: Go look into Kepler and Copernicus.

• Two: People being burnt at the stake was reserved for those who were accused of witchcraft, who were mostly those who practiced other folk-religions and used traditional medical practices not approved by the church.

• Three: When given a choice, people will make their own choice -- not the one you will assume they will make; they are not you and as such they have had their own experiences which influence the decisions they will make, so they will not necessarily do as you think they will.

• Four: Morality, perceived Good, and perceived Evil is determined by society. In a society where you are raised that killing someone for giving a starving child bread is a Good act, then you would believe that morally it is a Good act even if in another it would be considered Evil. This is whether or not religion is present.

 

[Dreamcycler]

I find religion In general to be crazy,

I always distrust people who know so much about what God wants them to do to their fellows.
Susan B. Anthony
The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never worshipped anything but himself.
Richard Francis Burton

 

[MajorasMask]

Personally i'm fine with whatever you believe provided that it is peaceful, and does not cause long term damage.

However i'm a little bit annoyed that many governments have law based on religious text, which I think is silly as there is no concrete proof for the existence of God, or Gods. Say what you will, law should be based on what is known to be true. Like, make rape illegal because it seriously fucks up the victims life, not because a book ''says so''.