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Suggestion Buff up classes, nerf op classes - Time to get some balance

Archmage_Lloyd

Soulsand
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
All you people are going overboard on this post like LOL ... Otherwise some changes i completely agree with And something to Add. Reduce Kick CD and raise silence, Other wise ANY caster class can beat it which by The love triangle terms (Rogue > Caster > warrior > rogue Healer in the middle ) Also Runeblade needs Flameshield and firewave removed and some other skills added that actually complement its title of "Elemental Blades"
 

MajorasMask

Ungodly
Joined
Sep 3, 2011
Location
Earth

You deserve some sex for what you just wrote... :eek:

I 100% agree, the balance team should be composed of more than just the top-PvPers.

Also, as for the voting idea, a main issue would be the abuse of polls, people making alt accounts to fix voting, ect. A way to fix this would be to take voting into account, but for the balance team (hopefully by then the team itself would be balanced) would consider the idea, to see if it is logical. For instance, if a bat-shit crazy idea got tons of ''Yes we want this'' votes, then voting shouldn't be considered, and the idea itself should have priority. Infact, in any case, the actual suggestion should be priority, THEN what the community wants..

That's what I think.
 

Joka10

Soulsand
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
I'm pretty sure the admins can do stuff about alternate accounts, but I suppose some amount of balance team discretion could be involved. They would have to say why they were doing it, though, to prevent underhanded activities, and the veto could be vetoed by the community if they really didn't like it.
 
Joined
Mar 9, 2012
@kevinlive

You don't want "shit" posted on here, maybe you should try opening your eyes and seeing that other players aren't the ones posting "shit". You have numerous players countering your arguments, and the majority of your responses have been half assed beginning and ending with an insult to the poster. You want to be taken seriously? Quit being an ass to people trying to counter an argument. You have an inflated ego currently and anyone in this thread that disagrees is automatically wrong in your book.

This thread is pathetic and I am taking nothing you say seriously until you change your attitude on this whole subject. That does not mean you have to change your viewpoint, so don't try and twist words, I want you to be able to respectfully and logically explain your side, with numbers and examples to back you up, not this "I have been all classes I know what i'm talking about" crap, that doesn't fly. You need to be able to show and prove your points, we don't take your word for this stuff until you have proven you really do know what your talking about. At this point, with all these counters to your argument, it is VERY clear you don't know for sure what your talking about until you prove yourself right, not because you think yourself right.

Yeah, you're not making a valid point either; bashing someone doesn't make it a valid argument. I could call your post "shit" because you haven't backed up too why his post was "shit".

As for the topic goes; this is not a "buff me, nerf them" post. We're trying to persuade each other as to why classes aren't balanced. Of course rogues are going to call warriors OP, they are dominated 80% of the time, and by a LONG SHOT; it's making the gameplay more dull then anything.

Here is my argument as too why dragoons are strong....

Dragoons are a problem. When you give someone the ability to run from almost any situation (if your not dumb), and the ability to 5 shot any rogues, it will OBVIOUSLY cause complaints. This is one of the flaws to r-p-s.... People play'd rogues because they have the false reputation of being able to dish out SERIOUS damage, when in reality; armor > dps....
A dragoon at lvl 60 will get 70 damage, and a lvl 60 ninja would get about 100 damage. At first look, people will go "danngg ninja op" disregarding the fact that dragoons can disarm, and negate 60% of it. Disarm is almost like a indirect silence, as a lot of skills require the use of a sword to use.
Skills also reset the damage counter, so you can hit skill hit skill hit, in half a second. Dragoons can do it well, due too the fact that a lot of their skills don't knock enemies back super distances; even if they do, jump....

I've said this once, and i'll say it again.... Things on paper, are seriously different then things that happen in the game. Before anyone spec'd (sept that one ranger) people complained about rogue's kick. So they got a nerf... It's easy to see a rogue kill other classes, as they have the most dps early on.

So why when we ask for compensation, we get bashed?

People complained about ninja's damage because they are made to deal A LOT OF DAMAGE.... so what happens? they get nerf'd....

The only people i really see arguing against us are other warriors. I respect that, they like to keep their classes just the way they are, as they are the only ones who really know how the class works. So don't use a stupid argument like "oh everyone complaining are only rogues...." well just letting you know; statistically speaking; there are only 4 classes to choose from, therefore 25% of the server is rogues. (ik this is not true, but i can guarantee you no one has actually made a count) So don't use that as a supporting argument.

My argument to R-P-S gameplay

This is an mmorpg, not a moba like league or dota. We cannot always tell who we are fighting 90% of the time, we cannot always pick ahead of time a counter to every class; thats just ridiculous. New players will get frustrated, as they don't have the opportunity to fight with everyone else. Town's are getting highly selective, which is a noob repellent.
 

Oudaiesty

Legacy Supporter 6
Joined
Aug 27, 2012
Honestly I don't think the players should influence the balance but hard data and statistics.
Balance will be defined indefinitely and adding new skills will be easy.
 

Fjordsen

Legacy Supporter 6
Joined
Oct 30, 2011
cleave takes 3 hearts from me.....
Cleave is good against mobs, but in a 1v1 for example a samurai could deal the same damage using Bleed. Cleave takes half of your stam, Bleed takes 6 stam. Nobody uses Cleave in PvP, Dragoons needs their stam for Jump, Impale etc. And samurais need it for Bleed, Bash, Bladegrasp and One.
 

Oudaiesty

Legacy Supporter 6
Joined
Aug 27, 2012
My argument to R-P-S gameplay

This is an mmorpg, not a moba like league or dota. We cannot always tell who we are fighting 90% of the time, we cannot always pick ahead of time a counter to every class; thats just ridiculous. New players will get frustrated, as they don't have the opportunity to fight with everyone else. Town's are getting highly selective, which is a noob repellent.

Technically that is how the server currently operates. I've long since suggested something else that could be a bit less cyclically dependent on the other classes and more focused on an actual goal. But yes I do agree with you, its impossible to always have the right cards at hand until after you get wiped out haha.

A step in a direction where people can see how the classes stack up so that people will make class decisions based on their personalities and play styles makes for a much more interesting game.
 

Iarbobray

Legacy Supporter 2
Joined
May 14, 2011
My personal opinion is that necromancer should be nerfed to hell to make people have no reason to play them. I want to be one of the only necromancers again :(
/Stupid and selfish post over
 

Kwong050

Holy Shit!
Joined
Nov 6, 2011
Yeah, you're not making a valid point either; bashing someone doesn't make it a valid argument. I could call your post "shit" because you haven't backed up too why his post was "shit".

As for the topic goes; this is not a "buff me, nerf them" post. We're trying to persuade each other as to why classes aren't balanced. Of course rogues are going to call warriors OP, they are dominated 80% of the time, and by a LONG SHOT; it's making the gameplay more dull then anything.

Here is my argument as too why dragoons are strong....

Dragoons are a problem. When you give someone the ability to run from almost any situation (if your not dumb), and the ability to 5 shot any rogues, it will OBVIOUSLY cause complaints. This is one of the flaws to r-p-s.... People play'd rogues because they have the false reputation of being able to dish out SERIOUS damage, when in reality; armor > dps....
A dragoon at lvl 60 will get 70 damage, and a lvl 60 ninja would get about 100 damage. At first look, people will go "danngg ninja op" disregarding the fact that dragoons can disarm, and negate 60% of it. Disarm is almost like a indirect silence, as a lot of skills require the use of a sword to use.
Skills also reset the damage counter, so you can hit skill hit skill hit, in half a second. Dragoons can do it well, due too the fact that a lot of their skills don't knock enemies back super distances; even if they do, jump....

I've said this once, and i'll say it again.... Things on paper, are seriously different then things that happen in the game. Before anyone spec'd (sept that one ranger) people complained about rogue's kick. So they got a nerf... It's easy to see a rogue kill other classes, as they have the most dps early on.

So why when we ask for compensation, we get bashed?

People complained about ninja's damage because they are made to deal A LOT OF DAMAGE.... so what happens? they get nerf'd....

The only people i really see arguing against us are other warriors. I respect that, they like to keep their classes just the way they are, as they are the only ones who really know how the class works. So don't use a stupid argument like "oh everyone complaining are only rogues...." well just letting you know; statistically speaking; there are only 4 classes to choose from, therefore 25% of the server is rogues. (ik this is not true, but i can guarantee you no one has actually made a count) So don't use that as a supporting argument.

My argument to R-P-S gameplay

This is an mmorpg, not a moba like league or dota. We cannot always tell who we are fighting 90% of the time, we cannot always pick ahead of time a counter to every class; thats just ridiculous. New players will get frustrated, as they don't have the opportunity to fight with everyone else. Town's are getting highly selective, which is a noob repellent.
once the dragoon disarms, the ninja should just back until it wears off
 

look_out

Legacy Supporter 3
Joined
Mar 27, 2011
I just have to say... There is work to be done for all classes. Not just nerf warriors (although samurai is how you saya da inblanced imo) or buff rogue armor or caster damage nerf... people need to start taking everyclass fight into account not just 1v1s. and go from there for now.

but what do i know
 

NuclearCouch

Staff member
Community Manager
Administrator
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Location
USA
@kevinlive Can you do a write up on Disciple? There not fun to fight.

Also. Runeblade needs a buff if anything. It's the most outclassed rogue spec out there. Needs a tad more health, they will get taken out instantly in any team fight.
 

Falker57

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Oct 19, 2011
OH, Because cleave is such a good PVP skill. I honestly wouldn't even expect this kind of stupidity from an eclipse member...
Before you go about getting out all your personal bashing out why dont you actually understand what I am saying? lol it causes LESS stam then bash and does more damage plus its and aoe. I dont really think you guys even knew this.... Etkenn it used to cause half your stam. Check now lol. For dragoons, lets say, they dont really have many skills that do damage other than their spade. Samurais cleave isnt as helpful
 
A

alexhoff1

All I have to say is that this post seems objective towards buffing rogues.

healers - are out of it
Warriors - (rogues anti-class) are trying to be nerfed, I agree they are hard to kill but this is no excuse if you're a rogue.
Casters - rogues that didn't give a dam or were awful last map finally face challenges where casters can kill them
Rogues - are seemingly the weakest class in most opinions, just because they lost a lot of their damage output, and that other classes got buffed.

Last map there were more Ninjas then anything else. Now that you picked the wrong class, you opt for a buff on yourself, or a nerf on them.

It's more fair now then it was before.

On the other hand..
I do agree that some changes should be made, but this is ridiculous!
You want Necros - which already pierce armor - to do 150 damage AGAIN? They can't miss, which makes this an extremely unfair advantage compared to wizard. However a buff could be used, but that is just not the buff.
Opting for Ninjas - 125-140 ? damage with a dia sword, eviscerate, kick, sneak, backflip, and a lot more that are burst damages. It's fair now that one was removed, no buff needed.
Warriors.
I find trouble explaining what's wrong with them..
how about that they have insane HP, and too much armor?
how about they have high mobility, and still high armor and damage output?
I don't know. I only know that defeating one as a caster is much more difficult than it should be, probably because they just don't die.


Joka10, you reallyyyy should summarize more. lol
 

cschris54321

Soulsand
Joined
Jul 8, 2012
Now this is my kind of thread.

Honestly, their just seems to be that warriors have too much armor. If you nerf warriors armor then it will only hert them while fighting rouges and healers to a lesser extent, and the main complaint about this thread is that warriors just utterly poop on rouges. Don't nerf their hp, because that would mess up the warrior vs caster, and if you want to have casters have a bigger advantage just adjust warrior slows. Rouges are at a good stance vs casters, they can wreck them up close, and most of the time get away if they need to. Paladins have too much slow (AOE CC and 3 seconds stun for them LOL pros) and damage output for how tanky they are, but apparently they are still being worked on so thats ok for now. Sammy seems to do too much damage for how tanky they are if you compare them to ninjas, but I mean at level 60 they have a 80 percent chance to do double damage while sneaking, which they can do while running for 3 mins straight.
 
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