Patch Notes - 10/01/13 to 10/14/13

[macura]

• Players will now have their armor and held item restored on death. This is for the rare custom-items (weps and armor) coming in soon. When karma comes back in, murderers will have their items drop on death. Items on death will take a durability hit of 10-20% soon.

This is dumb. First off not losing all of your stuff when you die is not very hardcore, it was understandable with runestones because they were like 5kc. Second off it makes no sense that evil players drop all of their stuff while other players do not when the arguement that you made saying that the negativd modifiers to being evil are balanced by the loot. If the karma system (which i think is a good concept but awefully exicuted) come back then how can loot be a compensation when the player doesnt even get the fucking loot.

 

[ytiggidmas]

This is dumb. First off not losing all of your stuff when you die is not very hardcore, it was understandable with runestones because they were like 5kc. Second off it makes no sense that evil players drop all of their stuff while other players do not when the arguement that you made saying that the negativd modifiers to being evil are balanced by the loot. If the karma system (which i think is a good concept but awefully exicuted) come back then can loot be a compensation when the player doesnt even get the fucking loot.

agreed. Shit just doesn't make sense.

 

[Warmachinexp]

I'm on the good side of Karma and that still sounds terribly unfair.

 

[Ultanian]

This is dumb. First off not losing all of your stuff when you die is not very hardcore, it was understandable with runestones because they were like 5kc. Second off it makes no sense that evil players drop all of their stuff while other players do not when the arguement that you made saying that the negativd modifiers to being evil are balanced by the loot. If the karma system (which i think is a good concept but awefully exicuted) come back then can loot be a compensation when the player doesnt even get the fucking loot.

Evil has gots to have it's disadvantages...

 

[joshtsai]

Evil has gots to have it's disadvantages...

And it's advantages. With this has none over good.

 

[mikehk]

I don't see why the crazy rage. nothing's set in stone yet, good will probably have a disadvantage or evil will get an advantage... but still, what're you going to do with an item that deals 4 extra damage? from what i've seen of people on this server is that when you get that item, unless you're confident in your ability to not die, you just stuff it in a chest and take up space.

although 1 question, how will /hat work with this...

 

[Beastmannn]

I still think we should have the old system with the warrior, rogue, caster and healer base paths up to lvl 20 -> why the change? :3

 

[Kainzo]

I still think we should have the old system with the warrior, rogue, caster and healer base paths up to lvl 20 -> why the change? :3

It may come back, but not before Oct 4th.

 

[0xNaomi]

• Players will now have their armor and held item restored on death. This is for the rare custom-items (weps and armor) coming in soon. When karma comes back in, murderers will have their items drop on death. Items on death will take a durability hit of 10-20% soon.

Hello putting my runestone on my hotbar and holding it!

 

[Dakinara]

I actually kind of like the inventory changes with all the custom stuff supposedly coming in (we will all be much more dependent on equipment, wheras before, a naked bloodmage / wizard, etc was perfectly awesome), but feel for the murderers (lol). Maybe if they will have that negative consequence of dropping inventory, they could also have some kind of positive like "steal 10 coin (not really stolen, generated by server) for each person murdered within x lvls of your own. You cannot steal from the same player more than once per 30 minutes". Give another way to get money anyways haha.

 

[Kainzo]

I actually kind of like the inventory changes with all the custom stuff supposedly coming in (we will all be much more dependent on equipment, wheras before, a naked bloodmage / wizard, etc was perfectly awesome), but feel for the murderers (lol). Maybe if they will have that negative consequence of dropping inventory, they could also have some kind of positive like "steal 10 coin (not really stolen, generated by server) for each person murdered within x lvls of your own. You cannot steal from the same player more than once per 30 minutes". Give another way to get money anyways haha.

There's a lot changing when it comes to normal gameplay and players will be carrying much more rare items due to it.

 

[Jonsoon]

With all these high cost and reagent required items coming into play, this will serve great purpose. You don't lose your t7 armor that you grinded for two weeks to complete your set in WoW, do you?
Though I must agree with the rest of the consensus here that Evil players dropping all items is a little steep, unless there is something to balance this that we are not aware of yet.

 

[Archestro]

And it's advantages. With this has none over good.

evils advantages are that you can do what ever you want to whom ever you want. No other advantage needed

 

[Archestro]

I still think we should have the old system with the warrior, rogue, caster and healer base paths up to lvl 20 -> why the change? :3

Personally I like this change. It goes with the new attribute system. You can customize your character with stats that suit what you will spec to without locking your self into a class.

 

[Archestro]

I like the idea of retaining your armor and held item, but could players drop random drops on death to help make for the items that the winner of combat would miss out on?

 

[malikdanab]

I'd rather it be that being "Good" has it's advantages, then being "Evil" having disadvantages.

 

[Jack_Reacher]

Why was replenish nerf'd for Wizards? Yea - the mana pool has increased, but so has the mana cost of skills! Unless you dump a lot of points into Wisdom, Wizards run out of mana pretty quick.

 

[Jack_Reacher]

ALSO - since mana costs have skyrocketed, will the mana provided by eating an emerald also increase? Eating an emerald used to get you 40 mana = two Fireballs. Now for two Fireballs, you would need 200 mana O_O

 

[lioIIoil]

I like the idea of retaining your armor and held item, but could players drop random drops on death to help make for the items that the winner of combat would miss out on?

I like the change as well. Some classes such as Bloodmage or Disciple could run out of the graveyard without a thing and still fight pretty well while a paladin or ninja couldn't. At the end of a Team fight it ends up that mage classes are camping the other classes at the gy. This will make it hard to camp graveyards .

 

[macura]

I'd rather it be that being "Good" has it's advantages, then being "Evil" having disadvantages.

Edit: Sorry i just completely misread your post, i accidentally read it as "I'd rather it be that being "Good" has it's advantages and being "Evil" having disadvantages", my bad this post is no longer really a reply to yours lol.

Think of it this way. In any game and in real life the bad guys go around killing and steal to get stuff/money. The advantage of being bad over good is that you can go around and steal stuff and pretty much walk into building and houses and shit to grab their stuff. Due to regions, covered chests and this new suggestion all of that is taken away. The advantage of being good is that you are the majority, you don't have to run from the authority and you get whatever benefits kainzo decides to give good players. Due to regions and not stealing money upon killing people the idea of being bad is even further broken by this proposal.

As an evil player with this proposal. You have NOTHING to gain from being evil while you take all of the risk. Unless I am mistaken the point of the karma system is not to eliminate all evil players or pvpers from the server (because if that is the purpose it is doing a pretty fucking good job at it). Even if there was an attribute compensation for this it would not be sufficient because there would be 0 point in attempting to kill people because there is nothing to gain from it. Genghis Khan would have never gone out conquering parts of eastern asia if he could not enjoy the spoils of his victories. Also there is no ying without a yang. Without bad there is no good and without bad there is no pvp because no one would want to lose their status as "good" by killing another good player. On top of this the way that good vs bad is determined is unbelievably broken because the structure of HC is not like modern day society, it is more like middle ages/renaissance society. There is not a group that is civilians, a good that is the protectors and a minority that are the evil doers. There are many cities and sometimes kingdoms that are spread about the map that frequently fight with each other. It doesn't make me an "evil" player if i kill someone who is good, the person who is good might just have killed someone who is bad, making them have good karma. It especially does not mean that you are a good player when you kill a bad player. I am in nature an evil player. However if i only targeted a town that had a few bad people in it then i would in turn make myself a super good karma player and make the entire town a bad karma town. Every time i killed an evil player i would gain karma and every time someone who might have neutral karma kills me, then they would get bad karma because i had good karma.

Furthermore due to the structure of the cities and kingdoms killing people does not make you evil or good, it just means that your towns are enemies/not allied. For example in the 100 year war between the french and the English there was no "good" side. There was just 2 groups of people killing each other. On HC whichever group started off with bad/good karma would kick the other side's karma in one way or another, and in the end one side would be evil and the other good, which makes no sense. The way the karma system works in HC just doesn't fit the structure of minecraft and herocraft. A better system would be giving negative effects to those who prey on the newer players, however even this is easily breakable. In real life a civilian would never confront someone who is easily capable of killing them but because of respawning noobs could "karma bomb" the person by graveyard rushing and forcing the player to defend them self.

Anyway, what i am saying is that karma is an extremely broken system but i know that no matter the amount of evidence i use to support this claim, that it will not in any way alter the existence or attempted implementation of karma. So i will conclude with the fact that if this change, that good players will not drop their gear but evil players will, it will destroy all pvp and all the pvpers will leave the server, that is a guarantee. And it does not matter if the evil players are still able to obtain normal gear from those who they kill because as kainzo said "player will be carrying much more rare items".

In short,
Karma=shit
shit= this change
karma +this change= 0 point of being evil
0 point of being evil= server without evil players + smaller player base
server without evil players= inability for there to be good players
no ying= no yang


This is the cycle that will occur, this shows how karma will effectively break itself. If you read this until the end, then thanks for having the attention span to do so.