Suggestion Upcoming PvP party limits and concerns

[werwew19]

It was clear from the 5v5 tourney that parties of 5 are unbalanced as hell. I don't see how parties of 10 were any better, but maybe HC just needs balancing overall...

Parties of 10 are better because the more people more variety and it gives both teams more opportunities to kill the focus target because you know you have 10 people on the battlefield.

10v10's weren't "balanced" but they are MUCH MORE BALANCED then 5v5s'

 

[malikdanab]

Parties of 10 are better because the more people more variety and it gives both teams more opportunities to kill the focus target because you know you have 10 people on the battlefield.

10v10's weren't "balanced" but they are MUCH MORE BALANCED then 5v5s'

Explain how AOEs affecting 10 people is more balanced than affecting 5 people.

 

[Egorh]

You say this like you can ONLY form groups of 5. If you have 6, form two (balanced class) groups of 3.
If you only have one supporter to 5 damage dealers, that's your own issue.

How is 6 going to deal with 10. Unless they are very bad pvpers (or too underleveled) it is very difficult to win a 6v10.

 

[Egorh]

The best way to satisfy everyone would be able to 'link' two parties. Linking two parties would be would disable PvP between the two groups. The groups would not share buffs/heals but still be able to fight together without the friendly fire

 

[Delfofthebla]

You need raid implementation. Parties would be sizes of 5 or 6, and raids could contain up to 2-4 groups.

Players can only give buffs to party members, and leaving the party removes all buffs from that party member.

Raids do not damage each other, but can heal each other normally.


No town protection from damage.
No clan protection from damage.
Just raids and parties.

 

[CoolBeans279]

Explain how AOEs affecting 10 people is more balanced than affecting 5 people.

And how is the person with AOE's going to be in range with all 10 people when he uses his skills?

 

[malikdanab]

And how is the person with AOE's going to be in range with all 10 people when he uses his skills?

Who says they can't? Even if it's 6 people, having larger parties makes AOEs OP.

 

[0xNaomi]

How is 6 going to deal with 10. Unless they are very bad pvpers (or too underleveled) it is very difficult to win a 6v10.

Now, that's just not a fair argument.
The problem was "If I have 6 and max is 5, I cannot do", which I said you make two groups.
You can't just introduce the issue of "They have more people than me" to it.
Even now, if you only have 6 how would you deal with a party of 10? That's not a new issue.
Just take trying to fight AD "Even if we split our 11 into two parties, how do we fight 20?" is an issue before and after.

 

[Egorh]

Now, that's just not a fair argument.
The problem was "If I have 6 and max is 5, I cannot do", which I said you make two groups.
You can't just introduce the issue of "They have more people than me" to it.
Even now, if you only have 6 how would you deal with a party of 10? That's not a new issue.
Just take trying to fight AD "Even if we split our 11 into two parties, how do we fight 20?" is an issue before and after.

My point was that a lot of the time you need to bring in 'outsiders'/solo players into large fights.

Example: AD has 10 people, but you only have 6. The AD members are all in one town so they can split up their party without worrying. While to match their numbers you need to get people not in your town. The two parties end up damaging eachother.

This change is highly favorable to large groups of players in one town.

20 people in one town split into 4 different parties, they will not hit eachother. 4 different towns team up to match their force, they end up hitting eachother

 

[0xNaomi]

My point was that a lot of the time you need to bring in 'outsiders'/solo players into large fights.

Example: AD has 10 people, but you only have 6. The AD members are all in one town so they can split up their party without worrying. While to match their numbers you need to get people not in your town. The two parties end up damaging eachother.

This change is highly favorable to large groups of players in one town.

20 people in one town split into 4 different parties, they will not hit eachother. 4 different towns team up to match their force, they end up hitting eachother

That's an issue of what happens when HeroTowns stops PvP. It was a silly idea.

 

[Kainzo]

The large pvp groups do not need any help at the moment "Winning" they already dominate the space. Let's balance what we can at 5 v 5 stuff - I'm not saying there cant be 10 v 10 - with clans and the PVP off, there's not much reason as stated.

The good thing is - this is a very quick config change and can be undone if and when we deem necessary.

 

[Kainzo]

You need raid implementation. Parties would be sizes of 5 or 6, and raids could contain up to 2-4 groups.

Players can only give buffs to party members, and leaving the party removes all buffs from that party member.

Raids do not damage each other, but can heal each other normally.


No town protection from damage.
No clan protection from damage.
Just groups and parties.

I'm sure linking groups should be pretty possible.

 

[Egorh]

I'm sure linking groups should be pretty possible.

Linking parties would probably be the best option. You can still have big fights where you are not going to hit each other. But you will not have all the OP AOE support effects

 

[Ellron23]

No town protection from damage.
No clan protection from damage.
Just groups and parties.

Yah please.

+1 for the groups and party system.

This is also a huge nerf to cross map raiding. It'll require multiple wizards to GTP crossmap.

 

[MichaelRL]

Yah please.

+1 for the groups and party system.

This is also a huge nerf to cross map raiding. It'll require multiple wizards to GTP crossmap.

 

[DefaultTexture]

flop

 

[Danda]

Actually I am not complaining to complain. Its a simple fact the buffs and skills and the way the classes are designed simply won't work out with 5 man parties try pvp'ing actively before calling me out on something.

I've played Eve, WoW, Tera, Neverwinter you name it MMO's are the only genre I play basically. It won't work out on herocraft and there is a very small minority disagreeing with me about the party changes.

Then that shows a flaw with our balance, our main tournament that is hosted is 5v5 so if parties of 5 do not work it needs fixing. By limiting parties to this size it will allow us more easily find these faults and fix them.

So your logic is flawed it's not that parties of 5 don't work it's that the balance isn't in the correct place to make them work.

 

[werwew19]

Then that shows a flaw with our balance, our main tournament that is hosted is 5v5 so if parties of 5 do not work it needs fixing. By limiting parties to this size it will allow us more easily find these faults and fix them.

So your logic is flawed it's not that parties of 5 don't work it's that the balance isn't in the correct place to make them work.

I agree it is the balance however I know and hopefully you're aware that the balance won't be completely reworked to balance the 5 man parties anytime soon.

 

[OliverDollar]

I agree that more players have a chance at PvP if it's groups of 5, I mean there are a lot more groups of around 5 players than around 10 so it makes it more fair, especially at the current amount of players. If it goes up then maybe this should change but for now I think this works. I also support the idea of groups of parties, sounds interesting.

 

[Danda]

I agree it is the balance however I know and hopefully you're aware that the balance won't be completely reworked to balance the 5 man parties anytime soon.

No it won't because as I said in my post we need to find out what is wrong with them first and to get any kind of play testing done we have to make changes to live because no one gives feedback of anything we do on test.