Suggestion Making all of PVE a Warzone

[Jrr_]

Why dont we make the whole map PVE????

 

[Beau_Nearh]

If you can get those numbers together to go raid in PvP, you should be able to get those numbers together that quickly for defense too, right? It seems a little unfair the the PvE towns can come raid in PvP but any time a PvP player tries to go raid a PvE town all that seems to happen is that the lava buckets come out and we can't really do anything about it. If a lot of PvE is moving towards PvP then why not introduce all of PvE as a war zone or even Jonsoons idea of a 5 zone rotation throughtout all of PvE?

It wouldn't me more surprised if more people turned up to defend. I've already made a suggestion to soften up the difference between PVE and PVP towns, I'm not disagreeing that PVE towns are better off that PVP towns currently. I personally don't mind if my town was or wasn't within a warzone but my opinion doesn't account for all of my town members, this goes for all PVE towns too. There's only a few towns from PVE that actually go raiding within PVP from my knowledge so I don't see why this is such a big problem for the "pvpers" who want to PVP if they have big raiding parties showing up to their town every now and then.

Let's face it, all the "pvpers" want all of PVE to become a warzone solely because they want to camp noobs. When they are faced with an actual fair fight (or bank squad), they crumble and don't come out of their super regions.

 

[Irishman81]

Let's face it, all the "pvpers" want all of PVE to become a warzone solely because they want to camp noobs. When they are faced with an actual fair fight (or bank squad), they crumble and don't come out of their super regions.

You need to stop and rethink what you just said... As a pvper, I understand that there are several people who like to kill the noobs, but to say that we hide from fair fights is a flat out false statement. If you brought 5 people to ANY Pvp town, I can assure you that you will have one, if not more fights.

 

[devotedworker]

Recently on this server I've noticed that less and less "Pvpers" are getting on and this may bring back some of them. I'm not gonna got into the whole bring back the old ways and that will bring people back arguement, but this is my idea to help a little. So as fella who likes some PvP I think this would be a good idea. I also have some other reasons than just that.

• It will bring back that element of danger that everybody loved back on the old maps, the war times can be 1 hour of war for every 5 hours of peace or something like that. This will help to keep some of the excitement up for the PvE side instead of the same old leveling, mining and building without any danger.
  
• It would appease the Pvper's so we don't keep on complaining about trying to bring back the older versions of the server.
• It will also help to create more groups, people will feel the need to team up and defend themselves rather than live on their own in the safety of PvE. This is just an opinion, but I feel that people aren't sticking around to long on the server because they try just living on their own and get bored, and I feel if all of PvE was a warzone then people would be much more likely to form groups and readily accept new members.
  
• This will also give the ability for PvE based towns to actually duke it out. For a while I've seen PvE town yelling at each other over chat but these war zones will give them a chance to actually do something. This will also allow PvP towns to raid PvE towns which was pretty much impossible before.

This is all the benefits I have thought of so far, but I also know there are some cons.

• Many people disagree with idea of with allowing PvP into PvE, because some people just like playing PvE or don't like PvP and I understand that. I think a lot of people don't give PvP a shot, when I think it is one of the most fun parts of the server, and this will show them a glimpse. Don't knock it till you try it.
• Others think newer players will just be massacred and that will make them quit. Sure it will make some quit but the others will band together and try to defend themselves, and then eventually get revenge.

I'm sure there are many more cons people can think of, but thats all I got right now.

In my viewpoint I think the benefits will outweigh the cons but that's for others to decide.

Thanks for reading!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Personally these are my Opinions and thoughts about this thread

"It will bring back that element of danger that everybody loved back" - Clearly not everyone liked it... as we have PVE ^_^

"It would appease the Pvper's so we don't keep on complaining" - Just because people complain doesn't mean we have to do anything When people argue with facts and statistics then we are inclined to make some change.

"It will also help to create more groups" - 2 Groups ( PVP + PVE ) - (PVE ) = ( PVP ) Thats bad math T_T
But seriously, I think it would do more to drive off people who don't like PVP, which isn't good for the server as a great portion ( 1/2ish ) lives on PVE ( As far as I am aware ).

"This will also give the ability for PvE based towns to actually duke it out." - BUUUT WE DON'T WANNAAAAA.... ' ' >.< ' ' Thats why we are PVE and not 'PVE and sometimes we like to murder people! >'

"I think a lot of people don't give PvP a shot" - I had by Bum handed to me constantly through at least 2 Maps, ( Personally by the a good portion people arguing for this thread, no hard feelings <3 ) and I think quite a few people have, thats why we like PVE instead of PVP.

"Will just be massacred and that will make them quit" - This is literally what will happen most of the Time. I can understand there are PVP'ers who go great lengths to not preform this horrible deed, but even if 1 person does it... it will still drive people off...

"This will also allow PvP towns to raid PvE towns which was pretty much impossible before." ( Removed Arguement about seige cannons due to the arguement of money Bias ) No base is 100% Fortified, it takes time and effort to break into a PVE place through finding holes in the walls. Or heck use the Raid Porter Building that literally puts you somewhere random inside a town. Theres that too Its pretty awesome

"Since when was townships catered to PVP" It wasn't originally it was PVE Biast at first, but its been modified a ton in order to try to appease the PVP'ers that argued that certain features where unfair ( And didn't just bash the Plugin for being horrible ) and its a lot better than what it was.

Share the <3, don't turn the map into a PVP Domanated place, let us have our PVE Asylum in peace.

 

[Malarb]

I'm not saying that the whole server become PvP just make it a war zone. Have war be like 30 minutes so that way nobody will have enough time to be repeatedly camped. Or we could try out Jonsoon's idea of a rotating schedule for war zones throughout all of PvE. I don't think this would ruin the PvE experience at all. You'd still have PvE for like 90%.

 

[devotedworker]

I'm not saying that the whole server become PvP just make it a war zone. Have war be like 30 minutes so that way nobody will have enough time to be repeatedly camped. Or we could try out Jonsoon's idea of a rotating schedule for war zones throughout all of PvE. I don't think this would ruin the PvE experience at all. You'd still have PvE for like 90%.

That would still cause issues though, nobody wants " You can do what we want for 10% of the time and you get to do whatever for the rest." That's not a good system for the people being forced to accommodate. If people want that, there's already 2 war zones that as I'm aware, makes up 2/3ths of PVE ( Or 1/3th idk for sure ). Forcing a play style on people no matter how "Minor" is a big change. I personally would not enjoy having to worry about PVP, even if it was "Just" 10% of the Time. If I wanted any PVP, I would move there. Pvpers looking for PVP shouldn't look to change PVE to get it ^_^

 

[Air_Restraint]

Love it. They max a hero.... And do what with it?... Kill mobs? Sweet, so fun. The hero pluggin is practically made for pvp. Some may disagree but please inform me what else you do with hero's? And all the pvers are mad I see. They won't be fully safe lol. Damn such a shame. Remember when there wasn't pve and the player base was doubled?

 

[Beau_Nearh]

You need to stop and rethink what you just said... As a pvper, I understand that there are several people who like to kill the noobs, but to say that we hide from fair fights is a flat out false statement. If you brought 5 people to ANY Pvp town, I can assure you that you will have one, if not more fights.

Irish, the last 3 times I've went over to PVP ended up with my party camping outside their SR waiting for them to come out. I'm talking from my personal experience here. The main diffrence between PVE players and PVP players is how about and who they decide to PVP with.

PVP players; they will kill anyone regardless and happily camp noobs all day
PVE players; I have not seen any PVE players camp noobs at all, they just camp these "pvpers"

This goes for accepting newer players in to their towns, I actually don't think I've seen any PVP towns at all recruit new players. We can all agree that the PVE side of Valorium is retaining more players when comparing to PVP both in active towns and general players. Rather than looking at changing PVE, we should look into other aspects such as adding conquest points or other mechanics to entice more players to head over to PVP.

 

[Beau_Nearh]

Love it. They max a hero.... And do what with it?... Kill mobs? Sweet, so fun. The hero pluggin is practically made for pvp. Some may disagree but please inform me what else you do with hero's? And all the pvers are mad I see. They won't be fully safe lol. Damn such a shame. Remember when there weren't pve and the player base was doubled?

On the last map, only a 1/3 of the avg player count on the server was on the PVP map while the other 2/3rds were on PVE (I know this as I was on the PVP side). The heros plugin was made to give players fun abilities, it's down to them whether they enjoy using those skills on mobs or players. Plus I don't really see any angry PVE players yet? All I see is PVP players trying to force a shit change upon PVE to suit them better. You don't see any PVE players asking for the whole map to be made PVE?

Do you really think changing PVE to PVP would automatically make all those PVE players want to PVP? Do you honestly think that?

 

[Beau_Nearh]

I'm not saying that the whole server become PvP just make it a war zone. Have war be like 30 minutes so that way nobody will have enough time to be repeatedly camped. Or we could try out Jonsoon's idea of a rotating schedule for war zones throughout all of PvE. I don't think this would ruin the PvE experience at all. You'd still have PvE for like 90%.

PVE players choose to go onto the PVE side of the map for a reason. Even if this change was added, those PVE players will avoid those areas or even their own town if it was within a zone until it changes back to peaceful. The logic behind all these suggestions is "if we change their zone from PVE to PVP, they will automatically want to PVP".

 

[Irishman81]

I'd also like to address the "camping of noobs" idea that so many people believe in.

During bastion, yes, there was a ton of graveyard camping and such, but as many of you keep saying, let's look at the present and not the past.

The only time that anyone would ever camp a graveyard or noobs would be if they have a bounty, keep mindlessly attacking them out of the graveyard, or are being dicks in public chat. I don't think any of the current pvpers only hunt down noobs for adding to kdr or anything like that. I remember early map there were almost no talks of this, because we LIKE big and even fights, another reason why we want some larger fights with some people who currently live in pve. Overall, the idea that pvpers are just mindless 13 year olds who hunt down noobs and camp graveyards is a stupid one.

 

[Air_Restraint]

On the last map, only a 1/3 of the avg player count on the server was on the PVP map while the other 2/3rds were on PVE (I know this as I was on the PVP side). The heros plugin was made to give players fun abilities, it's down to them whether they enjoy using those skills on mobs or players. Plus I don't really see any angry PVE players yet? All I see is PVP players trying to force a shit change upon PVE to suit them better. You don't see any PVE players asking for the whole map to be made PVE?

Do you really think changing PVE to PVP would automatically make all those PVE players want to PVP? Do you honestly think that?

No you are right. It wouldn't make all them come back. But PVE is the reason they left. It would increase the population over time. From experience I know PVE won't get removed. So the war in all of the north is a nice update.

 

[Malarb]

PvP is dying, it's just inevtiable. Those people who play on PvP all the time are bored out of their minds. There is nothing to do anymore, no real excitement on the server (for me at least). Sure there are PvE towns that say they PvP but they only come when they have large enough numbers and when they know they can win. Otherwise why should they even try PvP if they are going to die to the "savages". What made PvP fun for me was the thrill that at anytime I could get killed or just fight for my life. I know that some people prefer PvE and I respect that. But at this rate just make the whole server PvE and just create a PvP arena for people to duke it out. This change I'm suggesting isn't going to ruin the experience of the PvEr's sure they may get killed or log off during the war time, or just avoid the war zone, but this change will at least give mainly PvP players something to do so we don't go extinct.

 

[LordZelkova]

If you can get those numbers together to go raid in PvP, you should be able to get those numbers together that quickly for defense too, right? It seems a little unfair the the PvE towns can come raid in PvP but any time a PvP player tries to go raid a PvE town all that seems to happen is that the lava buckets come out and we can't really do anything about it. If a lot of PvE is moving towards PvP then why not introduce all of PvE as a war zone or even Jonsoons idea of a 5 zone rotation throughtout all of PvE?

Once wars and sieges are fixed raiding will be very possible. I still think towns under a siege should be PvP on. Also, warring towns can PvP anywhere.

 

[devotedworker]

On the last map, only a 1/3 of the avg player count on the server was on the PVP map while the other 2/3rds were on PVE (I know this as I was on the PVP side). The heros plugin was made to give players fun abilities, it's down to them whether they enjoy using those skills on mobs or players. Plus I don't really see any angry PVE players yet? All I see is PVP players trying to force a shit change upon PVE to suit them better. You don't see any PVE players asking for the whole map to be made PVE?

Do you really think changing PVE to PVP would automatically make all those PVE players want to PVP? Do you honestly think that?

The 1/3 and 2/3 thing is very true, but that was last map, a lot has changed ^_^ Now I would like to say its 1/2 1/2, but no official Census has been really done really

 

[LordZelkova]

Double post because I'm on mobile.

PvP is dying, it's just inevtiable. Those people who play on PvP all the time are bored out of their minds. There is nothing to do anymore, no real excitement on the server (for me at least). Sure there are PvE towns that say they PvP but they only come when they have large enough numbers and when they know they can win. Otherwise why should they even try PvP if they are going to die to the "savages". What made PvP fun for me was the thrill that at anytime I could get killed or just fight for my life. I know that some people prefer PvE and I respect that. But at this rate just make the whole server PvE and just create a PvP arena for people to duke it out. This change I'm suggesting isn't going to ruin the experience of the PvEr's sure they may get killed or log off during the war time, or just avoid the war zone, but this change will at least give mainly PvP players something to do so we don't go extinct.

Take jonsoons idea of rotating war zones, fix sieges and wars, make any town at war or under a siege have PvP on, and find a real incentive to PvP in said war zones.

That in theory would allow everyone to either escape the war zone and not have to log off or partake in a bit of PvP. It would also mean towns actually have to defend themselves.

 

[ChazzaMaGazza]

Maybe give this a look?
http://herocraftonline.com/main/threads/pvp-suggestion-new-war-zone-phase.56656/#post-447243

 

[Trazil]

If siege'ing wasn't broke it would cost only 2650 souls to create a fully functional outpost. Now you're telling me this is too much money to siege a town? Please tell me more about how it's unbalanced. And as far as I know, creeper drops were increased heavily (at least double), keep in kind you're not even taking ammo dumps or TNT factories into account.

"PVE discourages towns and working together aswell" Sorry what? The most active towns are the towns that are in PVE. Name one active town within PVP that has more than 5 members log on in a single day as we both know as well as everyone else that there isn't one. Most, if not all PVP towns are dead. I really don't understand why you've made such a bold statement like that without giving any examples. I could easily give Examples of PVP towns that are dead or are dying; Skystead, Tectum, Indar, Espa.

You can't force a certain playstyle on players. If you haven't noticed (most likely not as I never see you being active too) a lot more players from PVE are actually starting to PVP. An example of this was that we managed to get 2 parties sorted for raiding within 29 minutes. Keep in mind One party had 10 players in while the other had 7, name me a PVP town that can get that many people in such a short time.

I don't want to spend 5 hours getting money to siege a town, raiding and PVP is different from sieging a town. I have been inactive for the past week or such because I do have a life outside of herocraft, I play hockey, I go to school and I've had a concussion. I gave you an example of how PVE discourages teamwork and towns as you need no protection or help from anyone else and can do everything solo. If freepers and Indar are both dead then who just got the top 3 in the tourney? Lastly I can get people on if someone is raiding or there is some fighting for sure.

 

[Trazil]

@Beau_Nearh have you ever thought that people camp you because they just simply don't like you or you annoy them?
Changing everything to PVP will not automatically make everyone want to PVP, nor will it totally force it on them. You assumed all of that on your own. They can still build, kill mobs and whatever else there is to do, but it adds more to herocraft.

@minimike96 the idea of having PVP inside PVE with warring towns flat out will not work. You will have noobs confused how they are getting killed in PVE. Sieging will not work, it is either too slow that it isn't worth it and your cannons get destroyed while you can't be on or too fast that the town is destroyed. Understand a difference between raiding and sieging before you post again please

 

[LordZelkova]

@Beau_Nearh have you ever thought that people camp you because they just simply don't like you or you annoy them?
Changing everything to PVP will not automatically make everyone want to PVP, nor will it totally force it on them. You assumed all of that on your own. They can still build, kill mobs and whatever else there is to do, but it adds more to herocraft.

@minimike96 the idea of having PVP inside PVE with warring towns flat out will not work. You will have noobs confused how they are getting killed in PVE. Sieging will not work, it is either too slow that it isn't worth it and your cannons get destroyed while you can't be on or too fast that the town is destroyed. Understand a difference between raiding and sieging before you post again please

You're right they are different, I have been using them interchangeably, my bad. However, I do know what they mean and I see them working together. Sieges need to be cost effective and not cost 11 million souls to actually do. They need to be at max 2k for the region and cannon, why? To encourage some of the fucking money to be spent. Look at /money top, the top person has like 50k. What the fuck are they gonna do with that? Souls are worthless now, there's just so much money going around. If we make siege canons and outposts cheaper, the goal is to encourage people to war other towns in an attempt to possibly destroy them.

Raiding goes hand in hand with a siege. You start a town siege, said town is now PvP-on no matter where it resides, and people are free to come raid the town. Jump in and help the siegers, or help the defenders, or just jump in steal shit and get out. Rading on its own isn't very possible on towns without sieges due to regions and whatnot.