Suggestion Friendly Fire

[Dakinara]

Knew immediately you were a darkfall player with this suggestion lol. I wouldnt be opposed to friendly fire but I can say its almost certainly not going to happen, and its not like the combat cant be made more skill based / tactical without friendly fire. I would like to see the effect of both magic damage and healing group / aoe effects reduced in big fights as well though. However, before group healing can really be re-worked, a system needs to be developed to make single / area target healing more functional / practical without macroing 10 peoples names into hot keys. And some classes (cough beguiler) are so built around aoe damage that they would require skill revisions before an aoe nerf could really be practical.

My idea of a great AOE damage skill is the necromancer bonespear skill. You could potentially hit many people with it for heavy damage, but due to the path and travel time, both the caster and potential targets actions have an effect on how damaging it will be.

 

[Triptrippen]

I know this is me. Deaf ears and all.

 

[malikdanab]

I know this is me. Deaf ears and all.

It's not that we can't see your side, it's just that we KNOW it will never happen. Kainzo runs the server and I could never see him doing something like this.

 

[Triptrippen]

I love all the negative ratings I've gotten from this TNT

 

[Dakinara]

as someone who has made many radical suggestion threads, negative ratings come with the territory lol.

 

[malikdanab]

The key to making suggestions is to make small steps. People don't like change (Which is weird since it's humanity's only good point). If you want something done you need to either:
Make it in small steps so it doesn't overwhelm people or give what people want and slip in something extra.

I'm not against the idea of friendly fire, I'm against friendly fire in the CURRENT HC. The current system wouldn't work with FF added. If there was to be a FF I would see it being a separate world since people like a more casual experience.

In the case of negative ratings, I see them justifiable. Your first post was sparse of explanation. You made a radical suggestion without evidence or explanation to why it would benefit HC. Your idea is a very niche concept and won't be liked by many, but if there where to be a separate "Uber-Hardcore" world, I'd probably play in it.

 

[Triptrippen]

Thats the point, we will soon have a casual server for you casuals. The casual aspects of this game ran me away the first time I started playing, but I see a pve server coming and there is a slight glimmer of hope for a better experience for us hardcore types.

 

[Xargun]

Have you played a ranged class in a large battle ? This would kill most ranged classes... I don't hit me teammates with fireball, I cast it and they run in front of it. It would make a lot of classes completely useless. We would all be melee classes to avoid hitting our allies with our ranged attacks - I get mad enough when my party runs in front of me and blocks half my attacks as it is, if i damaged them it would be ridiculous.

 

[Triptrippen]

They'd stop running infront of your attacks real quick like, or not and you guys would do poorly in battle.

 

[malikdanab]

They'd stop running infront of your attacks real quick like, or not and you guys would do poorly in battle.

If FF where to be added, AOE/Skillshots would need to become stronger. Since the skills would be more risky, there needs to be an added benefit to use them.

 

[Triptrippen]

Nah lol they are plenty strong as is.

 

[Zephael_]

A big problem I see with this is that many aoe classes rely on their teammates to defend them while they fire off aoes in large group fights. If FF was turned on, any aoe class who runs into a mass of enemies while their team is safely out of aoe range is basically dead. They only have to be rooted once and can be bursted down in a matter of seconds by attacks from the entire enemy team.

This significantly reduces the usefulness of aoe heavy classes, and I think rather than encouraging more tactical play, people will stop using those classes entirely.

While I'm not entirely opposed to FF, the way most AOE skills work now, FF would destroy the usefulness of those skills. A lot of numbers would have to be changed regarding damage, defense, agility, warm ups, etc and I would say we would need to develop most aoe skills into more targeted, ranged skills. While this is technically within the realm of possibility, is just not going to happen because this is a huge amount of work and a huge change to the gameplay of many classes for very little gain.

And let's be real. This isn't going to stop the ganking.

 

[crazydodapie]

If FF where to be added, AOE/Skillshots would need to become stronger. Since the skills would be more risky, there needs to be an added benefit to use them.

so kill your teammates even faster... no.

They'd stop running infront of your attacks real quick like, or not and you guys would do poorly in battle.

yes

Have you played a ranged class in a large battle ? This would kill most ranged classes... I don't hit me teammates with fireball, I cast it and they run in front of it. It would make a lot of classes completely useless. We would all be melee classes to avoid hitting our allies with our ranged attacks - I get mad enough when my party runs in front of me and blocks half my attacks as it is, if i damaged them it would be ridiculous.

u already do

I think that this is a great idea, I believe that there should be a skill factor involved, this makes it more realistic and would improve pvp a lot. Also, if this is implemented i think that healing skills should get around a 300% boost in their heals. Obviously if this were to happen, the self healing rate should be decreased accordingly.

 

[crazydodapie]

A big problem I see with this is that many aoe classes rely on their teammates to defend them while they fire off aoes in large group fights. If FF was turned on, any aoe class who runs into a mass of enemies while their team is safely out of aoe range is basically dead. They only have to be rooted once and can be bursted down in a matter of seconds by attacks from the entire enemy team.

This significantly reduces the usefulness of aoe heavy classes, and I think rather than encouraging more tactical play, people will stop using those classes entirely.

While I'm not entirely opposed to FF, the way most AOE skills work now, FF would destroy the usefulness of those skills. A lot of numbers would have to be changed regarding damage, defense, agility, warm ups, etc and I would say we would need to develop most aoe skills into more targeted, ranged skills. While this is technically within the realm of possibility, is just not going to happen because this is a huge amount of work and a huge change to the gameplay of many classes for very little gain.

And let's be real. This isn't going to stop the ganking.

it will be fun to see the noob gankers kill themselves. I think AOEs should be like blasts from a tank, high damage capabilities, but not suited for pointing at ur buddies.
Not really a huge amount of work, just have to be smart of what to change, and its for a huge gain.
Aoes should be launched from a distance and short-mid range for upclose.

 

[mikehk]

Thats the point, we will soon have a casual server for you casuals. The casual aspects of this game ran me away the first time I started playing, but I see a pve server coming and there is a slight glimmer of hope for a better experience for us hardcore types.

pve server for more hardcore types? dafuq did i just read? you were getting camped last night and raged in O chat almost the whole time you were. I can see this suggestion coming from the newbs that get ganked often because they dont want to be ganked as easily. there's a reason camping is allowed in herocraft, learn to recall! join a town! being ganked is part of herocraft, you just have to get used to it. and as said, friendly fire would break alot of things...

 

[Dakinara]

It will never happen, but if it did, all of the caster classes would need significant changes to cooldowns / skills so that they can be more functional at performing single target damage than currently. Wizard / Necromancer / Beguiler all depend on using aoe type skills just to deal with one target, which i dont particularly like but its just the way it is due to their limited number of abilities / cooldowns. Wizard could somewhat function in groups with friendly fire, necromancer and beguiler would be pretty horrible as current skill sets stand.

 

[Eldrylars]

FF is great but DFO != HC and never will.
Reworks would be needed, it would do nothing to stop "noob gankers" or getting "camped," it would change the face of player vs player combat and the tactics used but not necessarily for the better or the worse, just different.

I have swam into walls for 80 days, so I have been there, I am perfectly familiar with both sides of the table.

 

[0xNaomi]

Can't comment on a unreleased class

I can, I'm the one writing Totems right now.
It is, in fact, a mass AOE, and the ones that harm will hit you if you're in range. (Aside from one that won't hit if you're behind a wall, but if not it'll hit)
Forcing FF on would completely undermine the use of it before it's even released.

 

[Joey_Beans]

pve server for more hardcore types? dafuq did i just read?

You've misinterpreted what was said. He was referring to the new map taking a lot of PVE'ers out of haven leaving it with a higher percentage of PVP'ers

 

[Dakinara]

I have swam into walls for 80 days, so I have been there.

This alone was always my biggest issue with darkfall and why i could never get into that game. For a game that promoted generally fun, action / shooter-esque based combat, why it was deemed necessary to force macroing / repeating the same pointless maneuvers over and over to "increase your skill" was always beyond me.