Suggestion Farmer Farming Problems

[Kainzo]

For farmers to get a monopoly on food, there would need to be a long-timer Out Of Combat Regeneration effect to ensure that people could heal to full even if they didn't have food.

Ever player can regen hp in beds.

 

[Danda]

Let's talk about summon bat cat and horse.....


USELESS.

Farmers can ride horses through the vanilla mechanics so it's not useless tbh.

How would this be achieved? Current restrictions are via crafting table recipes, which means Farmer has exclusive access to foods that come off a crafting table. Restricting cooked foods would mean introducing furnace gui restrictions I guess. Kainzo may or may not be inclined to add this.

Restricting cooked foods via furnaces is not possible unlike crafting benches as there is an automated process that occurs only when the user were to take the final product out. So restricting all

 

[WitchOnaRampage]

Farmers can ride horses through the vanilla mechanics so it's not useless tbh.

Restricting cooked foods via furnaces is not possible unlike crafting benches as there is an automated process that occurs only when the user were to take the final product out. So restricting all

Is the end of your post missing perhaps, Danda? I would like to see what you meant to say, if there is more.

 

[Yavool]

I am not sure about what it would take on the coding side, but generally I like the ideas presented.

Auto-replant when harvesting;
Passive skill: Bareback Riding (no saddle needed to ride a horse);
Increased soul & relic drops from farming;
*Significant* XP increase from breeding;
Pasive skill: No Scraps Unused (increased drops from shearing, and livestock slaughtering);
Skill: Summon Mustang (akin to Paladin/Dreadkinight)

The idea is to allow vanilla Minecraft to be the baseline, but to buff the Farmer drops above and beyond everyone else.
I don't know if Pally & Dreadknight steeds can die, but it really is a bummer that Farmer steeds can be killed (and thus their armor/saddles taken).
With regard to making food ultra-exclusive to Farmers, I disagree with this idea because we don't want to bottleneck the food chain for HC; granting them more XP and goods dropped from harvesting and livestock is a better idea.

And agreed, it would be nice if Farmer was a more valued profession overall. Right now it is probably one of the top two weakest professions.

 

[Fjordsen]

I am not sure about what it would take on the coding side, but generally I like the ideas presented.

Auto-replant when harvesting;
Passive skill: Bareback Riding (no saddle needed to ride a horse);
Increased soul & relic drops from farming;
*Significant* XP increase from breeding;
Pasive skill: No Scraps Unused (increased drops from shearing, and livestock slaughtering);
Skill: Summon Mustang (akin to Paladin/Dreadkinight)

The idea is to allow vanilla Minecraft to be the baseline, but to buff the Farmer drops above and beyond everyone else.
I don't know if Pally & Dreadknight steeds can die, but it really is a bummer that Farmer steeds can be killed (and thus their armor/saddles taken).
With regard to making food ultra-exclusive to Farmers, I disagree with this idea because we don't want to bottleneck the food chain for HC; granting them more XP and goods dropped from harvesting and livestock is a better idea.

And agreed, it would be nice if Farmer was a more valued profession overall. Right now it is probably one of the top two weakest professions.

Giving us more food drops won't help at all, I have enough food to feed the entire server but I can't sell any of it since anyone can farm potatoes, carrots, melons and cook meat.

The soul drop rates needs to be increased significantly, and for farmers only, if we are supposed to make money without monopolizing food.

 

[Danda]

Passive skill: Bareback Riding (no saddle needed to ride a horse);

Imo it would be better to add in a skill that crafts saddles for farmers.
Is far easier to code and solves the same problem.

 

[Jaw895]

I do think it would be awesome if as a farmer i could craft saddles and sell saddled horses to other players. maybe even have them craft horse armor, or have smith do the armor part.

 

[WitchOnaRampage]

Loads of suggestions have been put forward for improving farmer. In the post after this one I’ll summarize all the ones I found before my brain shut down.

Clearly not all these can be implemented, but there’s an excellent range for a Balance Council to select from.

I like Farmer best of all the professions, but I guess that’s because I’d rather log trees and harvest crops and animals than mine all day…

Farmer:

• is a more complex profession than any apart from Smith and has more skills than any other profession
• has a wider range of exp-gaining activities than any other profession apart from Merchant
• even has a few “pointless” skills that are simply fun to have – summoning bats, cats and horses.

Farmer's three main weaknesses are:

1. Minimal income

• limited opportunity to sell the class’s products
• soul drops much less than from mining ores
• gains no wealth in terms of profession relic drops or accumulation of mineral resources

2. Slow to master

• exp returns from farming activities are considerably less than those from mining ores
• many sources of farming exp require replanting, which slows the leveling process (wheat, carrots, potatoes, trees, and melon/pumpkin plot maintenance when stalks get hit)

3. Minimal usefulness to other classes

• Farmers have a monopoly on bread, but no one is eating bread with so many other sources of food available
• Farmers don’t have a great deal of purpose for interacting with other players apart from producing items for town upgrades and crafting bookshelves for enchanters (which Enchanters can do themselves if they have the leather).

 

[WitchOnaRampage]

SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVING MONEY-MAKING AND INTERACTIONS

Foods

• reduce healing on wild-found foods – maybe even drop some off the list again ie rotten flesh
• ramp up the healing on farmer-only produced foods – cake, cookie, pumpkin pie, as well as bread, cooked beef (a byproduct of leather production) – so they become more attractive trade items

Leather production

• increase the drop rates for leather from cows (leather is needed by town builders and Enchanters, but the current drop rates make it difficult to produce for a price that these groups will be able to pay plus that gives the Farmer a reasonable return on time spent breeding cows)
• give Farmer exclusive perms to craft leather armor, or share it with Smith (crafting leather armor is currently a Crafter level skill)

Chest shops

• bring chest shops in at a lower level, say 50, for food items at least and perhaps also leather, wool and plants
• give Farmer chest shop perms for Bookshelves
• give Farmer chest shop perms for Leather Armor (which they fish up)

Soul drops

• increase soul drop rates from wheat for Farmer only
• introduce drops from other commonly farmed items ie cactus, pumpkins, melons, cane (only a very low rate as cane farms can be massive) or from slaughtering animals, for Farmer only

Wool production

• limit the use of shears to collect wool from sheep to Farmer only

Review crafting recipe restrictions

• limit the crafting of paper and books (removing them from Crafter) and bookshelves (removing them from Enchanters) to Famers – this would have the effect of making town builders (bookshelves), Enchanters (bookshelves), Engineers (fireworks) and Rangers (compasses) dependent on Farmers
• limit the crafting of dyes to Farmer (removing them from Crafter, excluding bonemeal and cooked cactus)
• limit the crafting of leather armor to Farmers (removing it from Crafter).

Relics

• introduce profession relics dropping from some farming activities for Farmer only.

SUGGESTIONS FOR SPEEDING UP LEVELING

• an auto-replant skill for wheat with a high likelihood of harvested wheat being replaced with wheat seedlings
• increase exp on summoning skills (currently Farmer only) and on shearing (after limiting it to Famer) etc
• introduce crafting as an exp source for farmer
  • give exp to crafting some or all of farmer’s specialty items: bread, cake, cookie, mushroom stew, pumpkin pie, bookshelf, carrot on a stick, jack’o’lantern, lead
  • but not on these: melon/pumpkin seeds, melon block, sugar, white wool (from string), hay and wheat (from each other)
  • NOTE Farmer can craft these items that already have exp on them (but Farmer doesn’t receive it at this time): gold/diamond axes and hoes

SUGGESTION TO MAKE BETTER USE OF SUMMONHORSE

• a CraftSaddle skill which takes some number of leather and produces a saddle

@Kainzo

Tagging everyone who uttered the word “farmer” at today’s community meeting: @MovingTarget92 @Air_Restraint @EtKEnn @devotedworker @JenksLaw @Jonsoon @anevia

also @joeyjojo60 @Dsawemd @Evanist @Devin52992 @JazzDesignation @minimike96 @Northac @Xargun @Algsa777 @Yavool

 

[JupiterRome]

TBH Farmer is probs one of the easiest profs to master idk what your talking about

@Trazil - Just leaving dis here

 

[Air_Restraint]

• increase the drop rates for leather from cows (leather is needed by town builders and Enchanters, but the current drop rates make it difficult to produce for a price that these groups will be able to pay plus that gives the Farmer a reasonable return on time spent breeding cows)

Probably the only thin I disagree with. You get a lot of letter with a looting sword. Whether you kill it by hitting it with the sword, or just by using skills. The leather drop is fine.

 

[Clawscript]

Orrrrr add Soul shard drops for other crops.

There could also be relic drops, at a much lower possibility, but still. It would give a slight economic push to the whole prof.

 

[Clawscript]

Maybe even restrict planting to farmers too? Would mean players couldn't even plant their own potatoes/carrots

Indeed! Because theoretically others aren't "farmers" and they should simply resolve to hunting like our ancestors
However, Witch is right. I think the non-farmer community should be able to farm only one type of crops (carrots would be ideal in this case), basically like Cooking in RuneScape without a membership, if you know what I mean, in which you have an awesomely limited range of foods to cook, yet you still can.

 

[Edthelittleman]

Wanted to Chime in on this one.

I feel like a lot of the suggestions, while good, are trying to add to the game by taking away from it. You don't make Farmer better by making other classes worse.

Why not improve Farmer by adding a group element to it? Add in a Silk Road aspect. Take the idea of Conquest points and add an aspect for Farmer.

Let me expand. Random (semi-random) spawns of NPC Villagers (farmer Flagged) that would trade Hay Bales for Items (souls, Relics, all the things we miss out on not mining). Add these in both PvE and PvP. the PvP ones you wouldn't go to solo for fear of dropping all that hay, so it becomes a group event. In PvE add them far enough out that you wouldn't easily go solo as well (Zombie Siege at the villager camp?)

This way we ADD something to the game that encourages people to play an under used class. The rewards can be balanced from time to time. And it encourages group play.

I say let the game grow. Add to the experience.

-Ed

 

[WitchOnaRampage]

Wanted to Chime in on this one.

I feel like a lot of the suggestions, while good, are trying to add to the game by taking away from it. You don't make Farmer better by making other classes worse.

Why not improve Farmer by adding a group element to it? Add in a Silk Road aspect. Take the idea of Conquest points and add an aspect for Farmer.

Let me expand. Random (semi-random) spawns of NPC Villagers (farmer Flagged) that would trade Hay Bales for Items (souls, Relics, all the things we miss out on not mining). Add these in both PvE and PvP. the PvP ones you wouldn't go to solo for fear of dropping all that hay, so it becomes a group event. In PvE add them far enough out that you wouldn't easily go solo as well (Zombie Siege at the villager camp?)

This way we ADD something to the game that encourages people to play an under used class. The rewards can be balanced from time to time. And it encourages group play.

I say let the game grow. Add to the experience.

-Ed

Sounds very interesting. However I think it would be unbalanced to introduce at this time. Right now we're looking at what can be done to strengthen classes in their current form until custom crafting comes in. Custom crafting is intended to increase the interactions between the classes, the extent to which they rely on each other.

Your suggestion, as I understand it, would require considerable planning and execution with regards the coding, balance aspects would need to be considered (why give it just to Farmer? something like this would be interesting for all professions) etc.

I repeat, these suggestions are in the context of addressing Farmer's two main weaknesses at this time:

1. income earning
2. leveling.

 

[Danda]

• give exp to crafting some or all of farmer’s specialty items: bread, cake, cookie, mushroom stew, pumpkin pie, bookshelf, carrot on a stick, jack’o’lantern, lead
• but not on these: melon/pumpkin seeds, melon block, sugar, white wool (from string), hay and wheat (from each other)
• NOTE Farmer can craft these items that already have exp on them (but Farmer doesn’t receive it at this time): gold/diamond axes and hoes

This cannot be done. Either you have crafting EXP or you don't so it's all or nothing.

Tagging everyone who uttered the word “farmer” at today’s community meeting: @MovingTarget92 @Air_Restraint @EtKEnn @devotedworker @JenksLaw @Jonsoon @anevia

also @joeyjojo60 @Dsawemd @Evanist @Devin52992 @JazzDesignation @minimike96 @Northac @Xargun @Algsa777 @Yavool

</3 I was talking loads about Farmer in TS : <

3. Minimal usefulness to other classes

• Farmers have a monopoly on bread, but no one is eating bread with so many other sources of food available
• Farmers don’t have a great deal of purpose for interacting with other players apart from producing items for town upgrades and crafting bookshelves for enchanters (which Enchanters can do themselves if they have the leather).

I believe Farmers are also the only class who can make Carpet. If that's not true it should be added IMO

 

[WitchOnaRampage]

</3 I was talking loads about Farmer in TS : <

I'm relieved you noticed the post @Danda ! I look forward to your helpful ideas on how to resolve Farmer's issues and move the class forward!

I believe Farmers are also the only class who can make Carpet. If that's not true it should be added IMO

When I compiled the data values for the recipe restrictions coding, carpet was with Crafter. I haven't heard of it changing.

This cannot be done. Either you have crafting EXP or you don't so it's all or nothing.

The crafting exp a class can receive is controlled by:

1. the items in the "Crafting" list to which exp gain has been allocated
2. the subgroup of those items for which the Class has crafting recipe permissions.

So if Crafting exp were turned on for Farmer, at the moment they would receive exp for Cake, Diamond Axe, Diamond Hoe, Gold Axe and Gold Hoe, because these are the only items in the Crafting exp list that Farmer can craft as a specialist, as well as the Crafter level recipes that 6 of the 8 classes (excluding Farmer and Enchanter) should be receiving.

[This presupposes, of course, that Crafting exp is working. As I have bug-reported here, the only Crafting exp that seems to be working atm is for Smith which is receiving crafting exp for both Smith and Crafter recipe restrictions. The only other class that has specialist recipe restrictions is Miner, and it is not receiving exp from these, and none of the 5 classes (apart from Smith) that should be getting exp from Crafter level recipes are getting exp from those recipes either.]

 

[Clawscript]

This cannot be done. Either you have crafting EXP or you don't so it's all or nothing.

Well then what should be done is to remove xp from building and to add xp from Crafting! In my opinion, crafting is much more relevant than building since a farmer crafts advanced foods but doesn't really build once his farm is complete..

 

[joeyjojo60]

Well then what should be done is to remove xp from building and to add xp from Crafting! In my opinion, crafting is much more relevant than building since a farmer crafts advanced foods but doesn't really build once his farm is complete..

Makes sense

 

[Clawscript]

Makes sense

What remains is that it actually happens... :/