Dev Notes - 4.91+

[kirinelf]

Lol I know, but this is also an RPG server (Thanks Kainzo) and people want to Play a Role as somebody else...

Yup. But if you're playing the role of an evil person, shouldn't you be punished like the evil person normally is?

 

[Kainzo]

I admit, I didn't quite think that far. Assuming other people have the same moral standards as yourself doesn't quite work out sometimes.

To sum up your post, karma hit/gain points aren't registered unless a player is actually killed. A bunch of Good players could easily work together with an Evil player to harass a random player and let the Evil player land the final hit and splitting the loot. All the benefits of an Evil player, none of the drawbacks of being a Good player

gabizou What do you think?

Not how karma works - anyone involved in the murder will take a reduction of karma.

This includes healing, etc.

 

[Kainzo]

That actually would be unique and would make sense.

Not sure if there are even any hooks for that - are there?

 

[Arturec]

I could always leave party and do no damage and not lose points, assuming it's by damage/party association. (Based off the way parties work) I could always just be utility by tracks, TPs, SuperJumps, Piggifies (Maybe) etc.

And by my definition - (And most common sense definitions, because murder is alot worse than killing.)

Murder is Killing something for sport, personal gain (Power, Wealth, etc.)

Killing is killing in duels, large battles (or skirmishes) if your life is in danger, for food etc. (and mercy)

So would you lose karma for killing a dog? No
Would you lose karma for murdering a dog? Yes
(It's an example.)

-How would a neutral person work too? Could they stay neutral? (Retaliation according to how neutral works in guilds)
Or would they choose a side on their 1st kill? How would somebody gain/lose karma outside of killing?

-What would be basic Karma Value? (Do you believe man is inherently good or bad, according to those 2 philosophers)
Would karma start going towards [insterbasevalue] after [x] time for not being good/bad

If a good guy is attacking your town, and you are neutral to them, and you are a neutral person, and you kill them, do they lose karma? or do you, or do you gain karma? (Defending your home)

Would killing animals lose karma, as to balance the good deeds of ridding the land of monsters?

What is stopping me from abusing Karma grinding? A rule against it won't hold many people if you declare war then undeclare war on a town to reset your karma values... or if you go and hunt down low level players with good/bad karma.

If you were to /col duel somebody, what would happen?

What would happen if you had a friend who has bad karma and you decide to help them out and trade karmas (Get bad Karma, let him kill you.)


As you can see, there has got to be alot of stuff considered before you implement something like this, especially because this thing can be more OP than hoppers Xd (Hoppers have dupe glitches, LWC bypass and more!)

*Offtopic* Anvil for smith needs to be fixed.. .-.

 

[Jonsoon]

As you can see, there has got to be alot of stuff considered before you implement something like this

This has been in the planning for over a year and been being coded for over 5 months. Pretty sure it is thought through.

 

[kirinelf]

At this point, we don't know enough about the karma system to be able to make any accurate guess as to whether or not it'll be good or bad. I've made too many that have turned out to be false, as it is.

Stay calm and wait. You can debate all you want AFTER it comes out.

 

[Kainzo]

Update: We've temp removed backpack purchases (and abilities in game) while the plugin is patched. There are some extreme bugs that will cause users to lose items and we are trying to fix it - the packages will be re-enabled when 2.0 is released! The ETA is 5-7 days for 2.0

 

[Kainzo]

Update2: Several accounts have had coins frozen that stemmed from Backpack bugs. Investigations are still under way.

 

[gabizou]

Sorry if this post is long but, I'm going to dissect this as best as I can.

Murder is Killing something for sport, personal gain (Power, Wealth, etc.)

Killing is killing in duels, large battles (or skirmishes) if your life is in danger, for food etc. (and mercy)

Karma already has some logic to differentiate whether a player was killed in duels/battles/skirmishes vs normal pvp outside the arena area.

So would you lose karma for killing a dog? No
Would you lose karma for murdering a dog? Yes
(It's an example.)

A good example, I was even considering adding some sort of logic to grant karma based on the mobs being killed (granted, this also is affected by configurations and wether Kainzo wishes people to gain karma from pve stuff (maybe only bosses in dungeons etc.)

-How would a neutral person work too? Could they stay neutral? (Retaliation according to how neutral works in guilds)
Or would they choose a side on their 1st kill? How would somebody gain/lose karma outside of killing?

Currently there's no mechanics to gain karma other than killing someone. If they're good, you gain negative karma (evil), if they're evil, you gain positive karma (good). Everyone will start out at 50 karma, so it won't take long for people to become evil and such. If you don't kill people, well, you'll remain neutral forever, at the current state of Karma.

-What would be basic Karma Value? (Do you believe man is inherently good or bad, according to those 2 philosophers)

The basic karma for everyone starting off is inherently good atm (everyone will start off at 50 karma).

Would karma start going towards [insterbasevalue] after [x] time for not being good/bad

Not at the current time. There's no decay for karma at all, although, we could add some time sensitivity to reset someone's karma after a certain amount of time passed (unlikely).

If a good guy is attacking your town, and you are neutral to them, and you are a neutral person, and you kill them, do they lose karma? or do you, or do you gain karma? (Defending your home)

Currently, you'll gain negative karma (evil), I have to write some hooks into HeroTowns to determine whether the kill was for defense and then maybe add some karma loss for the raiders (depending whether the attacker was attacking a like karma person both being good karma etc.)

Would killing animals lose karma, as to balance the good deeds of ridding the land of monsters?

Nope. No PvE karma is granted atm.

What is stopping me from abusing Karma grinding? A rule against it won't hold many people if you declare war then undeclare war on a town to reset your karma values... or if you go and hunt down low level players with good/bad karma.

Karma grinding? Unless you decide to camp people at spawns or such, there's no real grind for Karma.

If you were to /col duel somebody, what would happen?

As mentioned earlier in this post, Karma auto detects whether someone is in a duel/deathmatch/etc. and will NOT handle any karma gains.

What would happen if you had a friend who has bad karma and you decide to help them out and trade karmas (Get bad Karma, let him kill you.)

Depending on your karma, you could start loosing more experience/coin/an entire level, so the choice is up to you really.

As you can see, there has got to be alot of stuff considered before you implement something like this, especially because this thing can be more OP than hoppers Xd (Hoppers have dupe glitches, LWC bypass and more!)

Karma has been in development for a very long time and I personally have been thinking of plenty of situations where Karma can become abused. I don't see how Karma could be more op than dupe glitches though seeing as Karma only affects a player's death.

 

[Kainzo]

Thanks gabizou - you saved me time

Just to note: Karma is the height of RPG. We will be removing certain restrictions so players can truly choose how to craft the server to their own paradise (or hell!)

Level restrictions for PVP will be removed.

 

[Arturec]

Wait where is the post for karma.. I want to decide whether to go bad/good ahead of time

-Thanks gabi for responding to my Qs (or QQs

 

[Jonsoon]

Wait where is the post for karma.. I want to decide whether to go bad/good ahead of time

-Thanks gabi for responding to my Qs (or QQs

It shouldn't be if you want to go good or bad. Play how you would normally.

 

[Arturec]

roleplay... would I always want to be the same person on DnD? or would I go play something fun and exciting...

 

[kirinelf]

roleplay... would I always want to be the same person on DnD? or would I go play something fun and exciting...

Just play in a fun and exciting way, for you at any rate. See whether your version of 'fun and exciting' is good or bad.

 

[Arturec]

What I meant was that Jonsoon lol

 

[gabizou]

Wait where is the post for karma.. I want to decide whether to go bad/good ahead of time

-Thanks gabi for responding to my Qs (or QQs

Here ya go

On that thread, there's all the information publicly available on Karma and it's development.

 

[Danda]

Unfortunately not. xD I'm not seeing how it's broken, and it doesn't break the purpose of stealth if the person using stealth is good enough. If you're good, you sneak anyways, and as long as you're behind a block no one's gonna see you.

Explain to me how you can be good enough to avoid detection of the ability to see if anyone is within 100 blocks of your targets location just by spamming in chat.

Knowing someone's there doesn't change a thing if you don't know where they are. Most people tend to play HC as though there's always someone there anyways, a little confirmation shouldn't hurt.

Yes it does and I will prove my point by quoting one of your posts.

Non-PvP'ers do the same; let loose a random cry (Mine is Test, it's even macro'd) and see if anyone hears it. If they do, hightail it somewhere, hide, or in my case, log out.

Without the ability to spam in chat to detect players you would not have noticed the incoming player and would have been caught instead of logging out/recalling because you detected someone near by.

The Compass on track is kind of stupid, I understand that he wants tracks to be worth something so people won't just randomly track random people, but I feel like he should just make the CD on track like 5 minutes and make it cost something cheap, that doesnt sink stuff anyways, by doing this he made alchemist's transmute worthless, because 1 stack of iron selling for 20c minimum (before compass) was only giving a profit of 6 coins... -.-

You're assuming the price won't rise because of the increased regent cost. But the price of a compass in raw materials is roughly 1.5-2 coins which isn't a huge amount. Ontop of this everyone and their mother has like 6+ stacks of iron blocks.

 

[Ultimate_N00b]

I always knew skellys were overpowered. Did you also fix the thing where 1/5 skellys had flame bows?

 

[Danda]

I always knew skellys were overpowered. Did you also fix the thing where 1/5 skellys had flame bows?

That's a 1.5 update flaming mobs can light you on fire when they hit you.

 

[Ultimate_N00b]

That's a 1.5 update flaming mobs can light you on fire when they hit you.

I knew that for zombies, but for skeletons too? Well, I suppose there's less, but lets just say I have gotten two flame bows in the same day for killing skeletons (Both gone of course).