Dragoon Jump = Useless

[HolyRane]

Don't jump as much?

 

[GraRona]

There is already a 4 second cooldown, and this isn't about spaming jump. I don't spam jump in a fight, I do exactly that, jumping into strategic positions, and from target to target. If eating food was instant it wouldn't bother me as much, but that it slows you down to a crawl is too much.

Also I don't have the resources to eat that much food. I play for 4-5 hours an average day. That's a good 800 melons a day. I use jump for everything, even just to mess around.

I can't expect you to understand.

Yeah, I probably would be complaining as much as you if I were a Dragoon haha.

But seriously, something had to have happened to jump. It was making way too many Dragoons on the server. I feel something similar to this needs to happen to rangers to thin our population. There are too many of us.

 

[Kingtom404]

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just feel you are being a bit melodramatic over this whole thing. Jump isn't useless, all you really did was lose a toy that you use around town. It's only a slight inconvenience in combat. It's VERY useful.

 

[iHazBryn]

Don't jump as much?

That's like telling a ranger to "not shoot arrows a lot".
Jump is the reason that Dragoon's exist, it is the bread and butter. Without it, they are just a slightly better damaging, slightly tankier Warrior.

 

[iHazBryn]

That's like telling a ranger to "not shoot arrows a lot".
Jump is the reason that Dragoon's exist, it is the bread and butter. Without it, they are just a slightly better damaging, slightly tankier Warrior.

It may seem a bit of an over reaction to you, but to me this has ruined my favorite class.

 

[Kingtom404]

You lost a toy, so don't complain about combat potential. Ruining your idea of your favorite class != making it useless and completely unplayable.

 

[iHazBryn]

You lost a toy, so don't complain about combat potential. Ruining your idea as your favorite class != making it useless and completely unplayable.

You keep calling jump a "Toy". Is Bladegrasp a "toy". Is Pray a "Toy". Is Bolt a "Toy". I think you get my point.

Jump is not a "Toy". It is the skill that makes a Dragoon a Dragoon. As of now its use is severely handicapped.

I'm not saying this was done as a nerf, I'm saying that this is a almost class breaking side effect of the new warrior stamina.

 

[Kingtom404]

You keep repeating the same old chant with no actual proof. You lose some combat potential yes, but the class is NOT RUINED. And I never once called jump a "Toy", you hard-headed idiot. When I said toy, I was referring to jump's use as a "Fun tool around town" I have already explained why jump is still a viable combat weapon. It is just no longer a toy to use around town. Jump as a whole is not broken, you just can't thoughtlessly swing it around whenever the hell you want to.

 

[SaberStone]

@kingtom. Thats the reason some classes have slowing/freezing sills. For example the geomancers have a freeze skill. If I froze a jumping goon at full height, it would take out nearly half of their hp when they fall. The point of the dragoon is to harass the other side IMO. I think of a dragoon as a jump in kill jump out sorta person who doesnt like to linger at one place at a time. I do not like to think of it as a pouncing killing cheetah sorta character.

 

[SaberStone]

And also what I forgot to add @Kingtom was that iHazBryn is *SUGGESTING* something. there is no cause to fight

 

[Kingtom404]

The why is this so called suggestion in the bug reports forum? Also, why does this post seem to be of a mostly whining nature? I am not fighting, I am merely trying to get my point across, which is blatantly being ignored.

 

[iHazBryn]

You keep repeating the same old chant with no actual proof. You lose some combat potential yes, but the class is NOT RUINED. And I never once called jump a "Toy", you hard-headed idiot. When I said toy, I was referring to jump's use as a "Fun tool around town" I have already explained why jump is still a viable combat weapon. It is just no longer a toy to use around town. Jump as a whole is not broken, you just can't thoughtlessly swing it around whenever the hell you want to.

You say we lose combat potential. That's EXACTLY my point. 90% of our combat potential is focused around jump.

But its ok that we lose some of that combat potential, you know, because we have lots to go around.

Kingtom, you have little to no knowledge of how Dragoons work, yet you act as if you created them. Please take your ignorance out of this thread.

I was simply suggesting that Jump be changed back to mana usage, because I feel that it does not work with stamina.

Also there is no need to throw insults such as "Hard-headed idiot" around. This was a friendly conversation.

 

[jmoney222]

The why is this so called suggestion in the bug reports forum? Also, why does this post seem to be of a mostly whining nature? I am not fighting, I am merely trying to get my point across, which is blatantly being ignored.

This was actually originally in the Herocraft Members Discussion. I believe it got moved here by Kainzo.

 

[GraRona]

While I do feel some of your points are valid @Kingtom , I feel there is no need to call Bryn a "hard-headed idiot".

 

[iHazBryn]

The why is this so called suggestion in the bug reports forum? Also, why does this post seem to be of a mostly whining nature? I am not fighting, I am merely trying to get my point across, which is blatantly being ignored.

My mistake, this was meant to be in the suggestions forum. This is obviously not a bug. Use your head.

@jmoney thanks for the info I didn't know.

 

[Kingtom404]

Since this has seemed to pass even trying to attempt to even SOUND like proving points, or using facts to report any imbalancing issues, this thread needs a @Kainzo and a lock. This has just spiraled into petty crying. I love arguing, but it seems nobody can bring anything to the table except personal opinion.

 

[GraRona]

Since this has seemed to pass even trying to attempt to even SOUND like proving points, or using facts to report any imbalancing issues, this thread needs a @Kainzo and a lock. This has just spiraled into petty crying. I love arguing, but it seems nobody can bring anything to the table except personal opinion.

I believe only the thread owner is allowed to request a lock. If you really feel that this is such a stupid post, just unfollow and GTFO. Also, how do we know that your arguments aren't personal opinions?

 

[TheEthanEffect]

I'll refrain from posting my usual technical analysis and opinion until after I've observed things a little more. It's likely Zoomsz and I will both master Dragoon tonight, so we'll see what things are like at 55.

However, I will restate the point I made in a previous class breakdown thread:
Dragoons are a highly specialized class, quite like snipers in FPS games. We get one core skill, as Jump (sniper rifle). We need that skill to get in and out of combat (being at range). We're very poor at dealing damage over the long term up close (bolt action rifle in shotgun range, stfu CoD quickscope people). We rely on getting in, imobilizing our opponent with our only other core combat skill Impale (headshots), and staying there long enough for our standard swing of 7 to break through both armor and HP. If you think you rogues have a tough time fighting an armored opponent, imagine trying to do it as a class with just a little more HP and some more armor, but hitting for half as hard and not having any damage dealing skills (Impale only hits for 15 and has such a long time that it's not much of a factor).

Nerfing jump is like making a sniper rifle take three headshots to kill. We don't have much working for us. We still deal the same amount of damage, against more effective armor, with less of our own, and now have a greatly reduced capability to get in and out of combat for the tactical advantage we need to SURVIVE, let alone win, and now have a much harder time catching up to fleeing opponents.


However, as I said, I will wait for a bit before posting my standard response, just to make sure I have all data available.

 

[iHazBryn]

I never meant for this thread to become like this. I just defended what I believe in. Kingtom, if you don't want to be here than get out. No one stopping you. In fact I'm showing you the door and ever so slightly pushing you out.

I have put out some valid arguments, you have just been unable to see them because your massive ego keeps getting in the way.

Now leave.

And don't lock this thread, I would like to see what other people can come up with other than a "Hard-headed idiot".

 

[iHazBryn]

I'll refrain from posting my usual technical analysis and opinion until after I've observed things a little more. It's likely Zoomsz and I will both master Dragoon tonight, so we'll see what things are like at 55.

However, I will restate the point I made in a previous class breakdown thread:
Dragoons are a highly specialized class, quite like snipers in FPS games. We get one core skill, as Jump (sniper rifle). We need that skill to get in and out of combat (being at range). We're very poor at dealing damage over the long term up close (bolt action rifle in shotgun range, stfu CoD quickscope people). We rely on getting in, imobilizing our opponent with our only other core combat skill Impale (headshots), and staying there long enough for our standard swing of 7 to break through both armor and HP. If you think you rogues have a tough time fighting an armored opponent, imagine trying to do it as a class with just a little more HP and some more armor, but hitting for half as hard and not having any damage dealing skills (Impale only hits for 15 and has such a long time that it's not much of a factor).

Nerfing jump is like making a sniper rifle take three headshots to kill. We don't have much working for us. We still deal the same amount of damage, against more effective armor, with less of our own, and now have a greatly reduced capability to get in and out of combat for the tactical advantage we need to SURVIVE, let alone win, and now have a much harder time catching up to fleeing opponents.


However, as I said, I will wait for a bit before posting my standard response, just to make sure I have all data available.

Its good to see someone with an open mind.