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Suggestion Making all of PVE a Warzone

Do you want all of PvE as a warzone?


  • Total voters
    50

devotedworker

Retired Staff
Max Legacy Supporter
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Location
Dungeon Heroes Server
One thing that a lot of PvPers have realized is that there are NO NEW PVPERS. We have the same old freepers, tc, umbra and LO, even if they are not called that. There are a few reasons why.
Reason 1. When people start on the server and if they are PvPers they go to PvP. Then they die a few times lose their stuff and rage or get upset. Instead of making friends or joining a town to help defend them, they go to PvE where nothing like that can harm them.
Reason 2. Since majority of people are on PvE they have not experienced actual real PvP, real 5v5s or 1v1s that are enjoyable, so why ever venture out into PvP? Ya maybe for a /hunt but then someone like myself will track them and kill them. It might boost PvP but not in the right way.
Reason 3. Ridiculous overpower classes, yes this is a good portion balances fault and the lack of a good coder for skills right now. When people from various towns play cleric bard and disciple, for other towns to ever stand a chance they have to play the same broken classes. This makes PvP boring and tedious. So why should PvErs venture out when they know their necro will not stand a chance against a disciple?
Having all of PvE a warzone is a step in the right direction, it will introduce players that would never PvP into combat and hopefully bring new enjoyment to them.
We have given PvE their separate world their separate continent and nothing drops on deaths, maybe try to appeal to the other majority for a change, it is a Hardcore Server after all.
The only PvP there is now is bountying noobs in PvE and going in for a kill, this is my last desperate attempt for PvP and it gives little enjoyment.
*Tisk Tisk Tisk* Munch I thought you would know better

"Instead of making friends or joining a town" - This is an issue that can't be avoided anyway with or without War Zones as they will still be killed. Good Solution, stop killing noobs people. Or at least recruit them :D

"PvE they have not experienced actual real PvP" - I have experianced PVP ( Sometimes even from you ^_^ ). Most PVE people have ( At least any and all that I know ). Thats why we like PVE because we do not find PVP enjoyable. You even admitted this is what happens to Noobs. Most Minecraft Players have done PVP at least once, so they know what choice they want to make. Its not like this is a unusual and rare concept

"Having all of PvE a warzone is a step in the right direction, it will introduce players that would never PvP into combat and hopefully bring new enjoyment to them." - Don't suger coat the fact this is a thread about PVPers wanting more people to kill. Its not about "Reviving PVP" its "Killing PVE".
 

Trazil

Legacy Supporter 2
Joined
Mar 31, 2013
*Tisk Tisk Tisk* Munch I thought you would know better

"Instead of making friends or joining a town" - This is an issue that can't be avoided anyway with or without War Zones as they will still be killed. Good Solution, stop killing noobs people. Or at least recruit them :D

"PvE they have not experienced actual real PvP" - I have experianced PVP ( Sometimes even from you ^_^ ). Most PVE people have ( At least any and all that I know ). Thats why we like PVE because we do not find PVP enjoyable. You even admitted this is what happens to Noobs. Most Minecraft Players have done PVP at least once, so they know what choice they want to make. Its not like this is a unusual and rare concept

"Having all of PvE a warzone is a step in the right direction, it will introduce players that would never PvP into combat and hopefully bring new enjoyment to them." - Don't suger coat the fact this is a thread about PVPers wanting more people to kill. Its not about "Reviving PVP" its "Killing PVE".
Let me just say, you have NOT pvped. Ever. Not in any way, you have however ran and sat in your house, sit there doing nothing while people kill you, or have your friends shoot raiders from places they cannot be reached. That is why munch said real PVP. You can say reviving PVP and killing PVE are interchangeable because honestly they are very similar, PVE should never have been a thing. Let's go back to the last map where there was no PVE , Bastion. There were groups known for killing anyone they saw, some that helped people, and others just enjoyed making money from the economy. Back then there were politics between towns and if you were getting killed you could message someone and they would be there in minutes to help you. Now what do we have? 0 interaction between towns compared to then, no kingdoms, no need for defense, no need for allies. This thread is not about just being able to kill more people, if that's all people wanted they would just spend all of their time on visions mindlessly killing each other, instead they want the risk and excitement back in herocraft that is no longer there. Stop going off your own little stereotype of what you think every pvper is and look at what they are actually trying to accomplish
 

Beau_Nearh

Portal
Joined
Jan 31, 2014
Just a heads up to everyone else within this thread or reading it. Kainzo did say in game that he will be adding this mechanic (turning all of PVE into a warzone) to see how it goes. Time to start buffing up your SR security PVE'ers :)
 

devotedworker

Retired Staff
Max Legacy Supporter
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Location
Dungeon Heroes Server
Let me just say, you have NOT pvped. Ever. Not in any way, you have however ran and sat in your house, sit there doing nothing while people kill you, or have your friends shoot raiders from places they cannot be reached. That is why munch said real PVP. You can say reviving PVP and killing PVE are interchangeable because honestly they are very similar, PVE should never have been a thing. Let's go back to the last map where there was no PVE , Bastion. There were groups known for killing anyone they saw, some that helped people, and others just enjoyed making money from the economy. Back then there were politics between towns and if you were getting killed you could message someone and they would be there in minutes to help you. Now what do we have? 0 interaction between towns compared to then, no kingdoms, no need for defense, no need for allies. This thread is not about just being able to kill more people, if that's all people wanted they would just spend all of their time on visions mindlessly killing each other, instead they want the risk and excitement back in herocraft that is no longer there. Stop going off your own little stereotype of what you think every pvper is and look at what they are actually trying to accomplish
You clearly where not paying attention in Haven or Aiegus. I was in PVP in both of them. Me and my town lead raids, ( Not really successfull ones but hey we tried ). It was only after it got really annoying and stupid is when I moved to PVE this map.

PVE is about half of the map, so that means half of the players shouldn't be here by your statement right?

Also in your town note, I'm allied with 3-4 Towns, talk to them pretty regularly ( When I can ) and I'm about to start a PVP alliance with another in a week or so. I'm not sure why you guys think towns are super secluded or something, we talk, have Multi Town Chats. If its a issue of town comunication, say that.

Don't change PVE to fix an entirely different issue. Thats just beating a Chair to turn on a light.
 

MunchlaxHero

Max Legacy Supporter
Joined
May 19, 2013
You clearly where not paying attention in Haven or Aiegus. I was in PVP in both of them. Me and my town lead raids, ( Not really successfull ones but hey we tried ). It was only after it got really annoying and stupid is when I moved to PVE this map.

PVE is about half of the map, so that means half of the players shouldn't be here by your statement right?

Also in your town note, I'm allied with 3-4 Towns, talk to them pretty regularly ( When I can ) and I'm about to start a PVP alliance with another in a week or so. I'm not sure why you guys think towns are super secluded or something, we talk, have Multi Town Chats. If its a issue of town comunication, say that.

Don't change PVE to fix an entirely different issue. Thats just beating a Chair to turn on a light.
Well maybe if i brought u on some of OUR raids it might change your thought, being on a winning team and with more experienced players is always more fun, your town was brand new you all were brand new, had no experience, you did not have the townmate that everyone looked up to for pvp advice like many did. You lost a lot since you couldnt learn and for that reason you resent PvP but when you win and are with people that know what they are doing maybe then you can enjoy it. I know how it is, I used to think PvP as another thing to do in HC while i was playing more for the Heroes experience. Once I joined LO and had gotten advice from veteran pvpers and we went on constant raids, I enjoyed it. I did not level dragoon because I want to defend myself anymore, I leveled it because I wanted to kill umbra.
 

Trazil

Legacy Supporter 2
Joined
Mar 31, 2013
You clearly where not paying attention in Haven or Aiegus. I was in PVP in both of them. Me and my town lead raids, ( Not really successfull ones but hey we tried ). It was only after it got really annoying and stupid is when I moved to PVE this map.

PVE is about half of the map, so that means half of the players shouldn't be here by your statement right?

Also in your town note, I'm allied with 3-4 Towns, talk to them pretty regularly ( When I can ) and I'm about to start a PVP alliance with another in a week or so. I'm not sure why you guys think towns are super secluded or something, we talk, have Multi Town Chats. If its a issue of town comunication, say that.

Don't change PVE to fix an entirely different issue. Thats just beating a Chair to turn on a light.
I was paying attention during Haven and aegis they both had things in common, PVE and not many people on them. I never saw you lead 1 raid and I was on almost everyday pvping wherever I could find it. You know what I meant when I said PVE shouldn't be a thing, don't try implying something I never said.

Lastly, what is your point of alliances within towns on PVE? You don't defend each other or raid with each other, you may be friends and all but that isn't near the same experience towns had on past maps where they were able to call on one another in time of need.
 

LordZelkova

Ashen One...
Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Jul 3, 2011
Lastly, what is your point of alliances within towns on PVE? You don't defend each other or raid with each other, you may be friends and all but that isn't near the same experience towns had on past maps where they were able to call on one another in time of need.
Breaking my 1234 for this:

How is being friends not the same as having friends to call on? I don't get it.

PvP: You call your allies (Friends even?) to help and have a good time or help defend or save you or whatever

PvE: You hang out and talk with your Allies (Friends even?) and have a good time, maybe help each other level or whatnot.

The scenarios are different, but both have one thing in common: Friends.
You don't build bridges JUST to have someone to save your butt, that's not how relationships work, between towns or players. You hang out have fun doing whatever it is you choose to do. You align yourself with like minded people. The PvPers hang out with people who like PvPing and the PvEers hang out with people who like PvEing. This doesn't mean that can't overlap. I talk to mostly PvE players in game, but live over in PvP and walk around usually (Though I never find anything on my little corner of nowhere).

My point is: Why the fuck are you arguing that friends aren't as good as Allies?
 

Trazil

Legacy Supporter 2
Joined
Mar 31, 2013
Breaking my 1234 for this:

How is being friends not the same as having friends to call on? I don't get it.

PvP: You call your allies (Friends even?) to help and have a good time or help defend or save you or whatever

PvE: You hang out and talk with your Allies (Friends even?) and have a good time, maybe help each other level or whatnot.

The scenarios are different, but both have one thing in common: Friends.
You don't build bridges JUST to have someone to save your butt, that's not how relationships work, between towns or players. You hang out have fun doing whatever it is you choose to do. You align yourself with like minded people. The PvPers hang out with people who like PvPing and the PvEers hang out with people who like PvEing. This doesn't mean that can't overlap. I talk to mostly PvE players in game, but live over in PvP and walk around usually (Though I never find anything on my little corner of nowhere).

My point is: Why the fuck are you arguing that friends aren't as good as Allies?
You may wanna re read it. I said they didn't have near the same experience, I never said friends weren't good allies...
 

LordZelkova

Ashen One...
Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Jul 3, 2011
You may wanna re read it. I said they didn't have near the same experience, I never said friends weren't good allies...
But they DO. They're all still friends hanging out having a good time. THAT'S the experience you have. Being with your friends enjoying the game. PvP and PvE ARE different experiences. But no matter which side you choose, you usually end up chatting or siding or aligning or saying 2 words to the same people and enjoy the company.
 

Nukadokuu

Gold
Joined
Dec 5, 2012
I really can't help but feel a mix of depression and anger when reading this entire forum post, and every similar one about doing away with PvE or expanding where/when people can PvP. The simple truth is that PvE exists, and it's preferred by the majority of players. Furthermore, I feel the need to point out that the predominant reason PvE exists is because of PvPers. I say this because I can't count how many times I've seen people quit because they can't even play the game due to being hunted down for no reason. I've been around here for over two years, well before PvE existed, and each map without PvE I see people give up because they know that they cannot play without being killed regardless of what they're doing. Because large groups teaming up on anyone they can or high levels picking on lower level players, or simply camping someone's death chest or the Graveyard they're sent to. All of these are why people asked for PvE, all of these are why people are happy in PvE. Had there been some sort of courtesy system in place, none of this would have happened.

And nowadays, it doesn't get any better. From what I can tell the majority of PvPers aren't willing to help people learn and get good at it. Not once have I seen a PvP town go out and recruit people, and be willing to train anyone in how to be good at PvP. I see trash talking, insults, and angry messages flying all over the place. I'm not saying everyone in PvE is innocent of that, trust me, even I think Lukevillani needs to shut the hell up. But my point is that you guys tend to create such a bad image for yourselves that nobody wants to be on your side. They see morons and bullies, people out just to ruin someone elses' day.

A lot of people love Minecraft because you can build whatever you want, and servers provide the chance to join up with other players to do that. I personally was drawn here because of the Heroes plugin, which many claim is purely for PvP purposes. I disagree. Bringing in RPG elements like classes and skills are what make this server unique in so many regards. What fun is it to defeat a horde of zombies by spamming your left mouse button while standing on a ladder? Having classes that operate in different manners helps bring new life to an otherwise fairly simple and strait-forward game. This also goes towards mobs and special abilities. I for one thought it was great back on Haven when mobs had special abilities, like zombies that slowed you, creepers lit you on fire, spiders made you nauseous, and skeletons blinded you. None of that is strictly tied only to PvP.

But to the point at hand, I can't help but be disappointed in the people who think making PvE a warzone will do any good. People like me will simply log off during that time, and wait until it's safe to log back on. The people who don't know what Wartime is (Which is every new player) will stumble around confused, get killed, get pissed off, and leave like people would do pre-PvE, further damaging the population of the server. Furthermore, aside from an excuse to kill PvE players, what would it accomplish? Congratulations, you now have twice the space to frolic around looking for PvP. Something tells me (Basic logic predominantly) that that is only going to make PvP even more scarce during the full PvE Wartime.

All of this being said, I think if PvP were more evened out and fair, more people would participate, myself included. A better system would probably be capture objectives, or things like the regular 5v5 competitions. Things that have high reward for winning, things that can appeal to all players. Boost tokens, special or rare items, or brand new or custom things. I personally would love to compete if it meant getting an item that made me appear to be on fire constantly, that would be pretty awesome. Yeah, I understand that it can be amusing to dominate a battle and win with little contest, but if things aren't somehow fair and balanced, are you really doing anything more than stroking an inflated ego? I'm sorry, but there's nothing cool or glorious about killing someone who has no chance. And I'm not pretentious enough to think my opinion is perfect, but try and think it all through.
 

devotedworker

Retired Staff
Max Legacy Supporter
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Location
Dungeon Heroes Server
I was paying attention during Haven and aegis they both had things in common, PVE and not many people on them. I never saw you lead 1 raid and I was on almost everyday pvping wherever I could find it. You know what I meant when I said PVE shouldn't be a thing, don't try implying something I never said.

Lastly, what is your point of alliances within towns on PVE? You don't defend each other or raid with each other, you may be friends and all but that isn't near the same experience towns had on past maps where they were able to call on one another in time of need.
We still have fun. Isn't that the point ^_^ It doesn't HAVE to be fun for you for us to be having fun. Your implying that your fun ( PVP ) is more important than ours ( PVE ), which doesn't sound right. We need to find a Solution that doesn't infinge on either, or else its going to end badly

Well maybe if i brought u on some of OUR raids it might change your thought, being on a winning team and with more experienced players is always more fun, your town was brand new you all were brand new, had no experience, you did not have the townmate that everyone looked up to for pvp advice like many did. You lost a lot since you couldnt learn and for that reason you resent PvP but when you win and are with people that know what they are doing maybe then you can enjoy it. I know how it is, I used to think PvP as another thing to do in HC while i was playing more for the Heroes experience. Once I joined LO and had gotten advice from veteran pvpers and we went on constant raids, I enjoyed it. I did not level dragoon because I want to defend myself anymore, I leveled it because I wanted to kill umbra.
Your really saying I've never won ( In the Entire Year+ I've been here ) has never ever won a battle, and resents PVP for my suckyness and never being on the Winning Side ( AKA every PVPer ever ).

uh... how about NO? ^_^ I've been on Successful raids, heck I was in Axiom for a short while ( A Fact absolutely nobody seems to remember ) -.-
 

Trazil

Legacy Supporter 2
Joined
Mar 31, 2013
We still have fun. Isn't that the point ^_^ It doesn't HAVE to be fun for you for us to be having fun. Your implying that your fun ( PVP ) is more important than ours ( PVE ), which doesn't sound right. We need to find a Solution that doesn't infinge on either, or else its going to end badly


Your really saying I've never won ( In the Entire Year+ I've been here ) has never ever won a battle, and resents PVP for my suckyness and never being on the Winning Side ( AKA every PVPer ever ).

uh... how about NO? ^_^ I've been on Successful raids, heck I was in Axiom for a short while ( A Fact absolutely nobody seems to remember ) -.-
The solution that is in place right now does infringe on PVP and look at how that is going, many people have quit because of PVE and hc losing excitement and the hardcore it once claimed to have.

Btw I raided with axiom, you never came along. Maybe once the town died but not in it's prime while we were winning fights.
 

skittles32009

Legacy Supporter 7
Joined
Jan 5, 2012
Just an idea here...might be a bit too over the top.....

but how about stop comparing epeens and actually get back to the topic on hand which is coming up with suggestions to increase the population on the server for BOTH types of players?

i know, i know... its a crazy idea right?
 

LordZelkova

Ashen One...
Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Jul 3, 2011
Btw I raided with axiom, you never came along. Maybe once the town died but not in it's prime while we were winning fights.
So you're saying because YOU never saw him raid, he didn't raid? Ok.
Also what does winning have to do with raiding? I raided a ton back on DG with Frost (We were terrible). We almost never won because we had like 4 people and were never mastered but we had fun hopping in towns and trying to fight people. I still go on raids from time to time this map, though no where near as often. I still don't win, yet I still have a good time. Winning is not the only way to have fun.
 
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Xelarator1

Obsidian
Joined
Apr 20, 2014
Location
Nevada
We could do something like
PvE - Sunday Tuesday Thursday
PvP- Monday Wednesday Friday
And then Split Saturday down the middle
It would be neat to have entire days where the whole map has PvP on all the time. Maybe implement a small +50% exp boost for these days to give others another reason to log in.
 

Trazil

Legacy Supporter 2
Joined
Mar 31, 2013
So you're saying because YOU never saw him raid, he didn't raid? Ok.
Also what does winning have to do with raiding? I raided a ton back on DG with Frost (We were terrible). We almost never won because we had like 4 people and were never mastered but we had fun hopping in towns and trying to fight people. I still go on raids from time to time this map, though no where near as often. I still don't win, yet I still have a good time. Winning is not the only way to have fun.
Axiom stopped winning, Jreems got banned = no more raids. Simple enough? I never said winning is the only way to have fun. What I was saying is that he never raided with axiom
 

devotedworker

Retired Staff
Max Legacy Supporter
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Location
Dungeon Heroes Server
It would be neat to have entire days where the whole map has PvP on all the time. Maybe implement a small +50% exp boost for these days to give others another reason to log in.
Again... this means that People who want PVE can't play, and miss out on a boost if they don't want to play on that day.
 

Trazil

Legacy Supporter 2
Joined
Mar 31, 2013
Again... this means that People who want PVE can't play, and miss out on a boost if they don't want to play on that day.
Then that is their choice, the original PVE was supposed to have half the xp and drop rates because there is no risk in anything there. They don't have to play on that day but if they want the extra xp then they can, that's how incentives work.
 

devotedworker

Retired Staff
Max Legacy Supporter
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Location
Dungeon Heroes Server
Then that is their choice, the original PVE was supposed to have half the xp and drop rates because there is no risk in anything there. They don't have to play on that day but if they want the extra xp then they can, that's how incentives work.
So if we wanted as PVE'ers to have more people to use Siege Cannons on, we should just half the EXP of PVP players so they come over. The reason Kainzo removed that was probably because its a bad idea. ^_^
 

Trazil

Legacy Supporter 2
Joined
Mar 31, 2013
So if we wanted as PVE'ers to have more people to use Siege Cannons on, we should just half the EXP of PVP players so they come over. The reason Kainzo removed that was probably because its a bad idea. ^_^
Are you really trying to argue that if people in PVE wanted to do a form of PVP they should get more people to come to PVE? That makes sense right? I mean if I live somewhere that I can't really fight, but I can use something to fight with I should get some people over here to let me use it on, even though they may be nearly as addicted to this game for the amount of souls I can put into it. Great logic there devoted. Congrats. Kainzo's original idea in theory was good, the people in PVE have no risks therefore should have to spend a little longer on getting their things. No risk but taking a little longer is a pretty equal exchange.

I'm surprised you actually said one of Kainzo's ideas was bad, you usually suck up to him :p
 
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