Heroes (RPG) - Your thoughts?

[Kainzo]

At the moment - you cannot lose levels - just EXP towards your next level.

The exp loss will be harsh but not utterly defeating. This wasn't a balance test, it's a feature test.

 

[Derelict1]

I'm not sure if this is a feature suggestion or a balance suggestion or maybe a bit of both, but at the risk of getting yelled at I will mention it anyway.

Make PVP profitable, I can already tell the people with the most c are going to be the crafters as they feed all the other classes equipment. While the rest are going to be left PVP'ing for nothing but spare swords and broken armor that they might not even be able to use, which is the case in every single minecraft PVP server, nothing but "loot" that ends up being thrown away.

There needs to be some sort of profit from PVP, whether this is gaining money from each person you killed and the person who died losing money, or even better implementing a scrap system which people can use to turn things like iron swords or leather armor into profitable items such as iron ingots and leather pieces.

I honestly don't know, but at the moment it will be broken unless some sort of profit comes from PVP. ACTUAL profit.

 

[Kainzo]

I'm not sure if this is a feature suggestion or a balance suggestion or maybe a bit of both, but at the risk of getting yelled at I will mention it anyway.

Make PVP profitable, I can already tell the people with the most c are going to be the crafters as they feed all the other classes equipment. While the rest are going to be left PVP'ing for nothing but spare swords and broken armor that they might not even be able to use, which is the case in every single minecraft PVP server, nothing but "loot" that ends up being thrown away.

There needs to be some sort of profit from PVP, whether this is gaining money from each person you killed and the person who died losing money, or even better implementing a scrap system which people can use to turn things like iron swords or leather armor into profitable items such as iron ingots and leather pieces.

I honestly don't know, but at the moment it will be broken unless some sort of profit comes from PVP. ACTUAL profit.

What's "broken" in your eyes isn't "broken" in ours.

We may consider something to this extent - but by no means are we going head first trying to fix the flawed concept of PVP in a building game.

We aim to bring balance and fun to it - by unique selections, skills, and gear setup.

I'll keep this in mind and see what we can do - though Heroes, altogether is trying to stay a bit away from iConomy/Coins as best it can. (This may be better from a different plugin)

 

[Derelict1]

I'm not sure if this is a feature suggestion or a balance suggestion or maybe a bit of both, but at the risk of getting yelled at I will mention it anyway.

Make PVP profitable, I can already tell the people with the most c are going to be the crafters as they feed all the other classes equipment. While the rest are going to be left PVP'ing for nothing but spare swords and broken armor that they might not even be able to use, which is the case in every single minecraft PVP server, nothing but "loot" that ends up being thrown away.

There needs to be some sort of profit from PVP, whether this is gaining money from each person you killed and the person who died losing money, or even better implementing a scrap system which people can use to turn things like iron swords or leather armor into profitable items such as iron ingots and leather pieces.

I honestly don't know, but at the moment it will be broken unless some sort of profit comes from PVP. ACTUAL profit.

What's "broken" in your eyes isn't "broken" in ours.

We may consider something to this extent - but by no means are we going head first trying to fix the flawed concept of PVP in a building game.

We aim to bring balance and fun to it - by unique selections, skills, and gear setup.

I'll keep this in mind and see what we can do - though Heroes, altogether is trying to stay a bit away from iConomy/Coins as best it can. (This may be better from a different plugin)

Glad to hear you're thinking of doing something about it. Also, I always though this game was a bit more about surviving and thriving than just building like in creative mode, but that's besides the point.

Let me just say that without profitable PVP people will not be inclined to go out there and kill someone else, which would remove the "hardcore" that herocraft is about. I never used to kill mobs, but when I found out you can get a bit of coin out of killing mobs on herocraft I immediately got geared up and went out hunting nightly. It's the same concept.

PVP is a central cog in almost all RPG's, especially in an RPG which all classes but one is geared towards PVP. Without profitable PVP the economy will not move unless this becomes a build server or mobs are made insanely hard or you add dungeons or something..

Again glad to hear you're thinking of fixing this.

 

[Kainzo]

I'm not sure if this is a feature suggestion or a balance suggestion or maybe a bit of both, but at the risk of getting yelled at I will mention it anyway.

Make PVP profitable, I can already tell the people with the most c are going to be the crafters as they feed all the other classes equipment. While the rest are going to be left PVP'ing for nothing but spare swords and broken armor that they might not even be able to use, which is the case in every single minecraft PVP server, nothing but "loot" that ends up being thrown away.

There needs to be some sort of profit from PVP, whether this is gaining money from each person you killed and the person who died losing money, or even better implementing a scrap system which people can use to turn things like iron swords or leather armor into profitable items such as iron ingots and leather pieces.

I honestly don't know, but at the moment it will be broken unless some sort of profit comes from PVP. ACTUAL profit.

What's "broken" in your eyes isn't "broken" in ours.

We may consider something to this extent - but by no means are we going head first trying to fix the flawed concept of PVP in a building game.

We aim to bring balance and fun to it - by unique selections, skills, and gear setup.

I'll keep this in mind and see what we can do - though Heroes, altogether is trying to stay a bit away from iConomy/Coins as best it can. (This may be better from a different plugin)

Glad to hear you're thinking of doing something about it. Also, I always though this game was a bit more about surviving and thriving than just building like in creative mode, but that's besides the point.

Let me just say that without profitable PVP people will not be inclined to go out there and kill someone else, which would remove the "hardcore" that herocraft is about. I never used to kill mobs, but when I found out you can get a bit of coin out of killing mobs on herocraft I immediately got geared up and went out hunting nightly. It's the same concept.

PVP is a central cog in almost all RPG's, especially in an RPG which all classes but one is geared towards PVP. Without profitable PVP the economy will not move unless this becomes a build server or mobs are made insanely hard or you add dungeons or something..

Again glad to hear you're thinking of fixing this.

Again - you misunderstand "hardcore" with "PVP-incentive"

Not having an incentive to go and kill people - doesn't make the game any less hardcore - it just makes it more PVP friendly.

Why yes - we have PVP in our server, but by no means are we a strictly PVP server.

 

[carmeops]

in herocraft, you can choose to go on pvp or not, your choice, if you go in the wild, you know it's not safe, it's god like that

execpt the death penality that i don't like (we already lose coin in death, why losing xp too?) this heroes mod sound good for what i tested it so far

but, for this test server, do we have any rules for this week? my little house was totally riped apart, nothing but the door left, even the LWC chest is gone:

have fun with the test server, i will come back when the real server with real rules and mod who don't break lwc will be back...

 

[Derelict1]

Glad to hear you're thinking of doing something about it. Also, I always though this game was a bit more about surviving and thriving than just building like in creative mode, but that's besides the point.

Let me just say that without profitable PVP people will not be inclined to go out there and kill someone else, which would remove the "hardcore" that herocraft is about. I never used to kill mobs, but when I found out you can get a bit of coin out of killing mobs on herocraft I immediately got geared up and went out hunting nightly. It's the same concept.

PVP is a central cog in almost all RPG's, especially in an RPG which all classes but one is geared towards PVP. Without profitable PVP the economy will not move unless this becomes a build server or mobs are made insanely hard or you add dungeons or something..

Again glad to hear you're thinking of fixing this.

Again - you misunderstand "hardcore" with "PVP-incentive"

Not having an incentive to go and kill people - doesn't make the game any less hardcore - it just makes it more PVP friendly.

Why yes - we have PVP in our server, but by no means are we a strictly PVP server.

Ah I see..

I am kind of new so I didn't quite understand what the server was about, it's just the threads you make for whitelist apps REALLY stress on the hardcore of the wild and the PVP and the stealing. I assumed this was an integral part of the server.

I was certain this was a PVP inclined server since the new plug in will have a bunch of classes that are about PVP and only one that isn't. That is also what had me confused, since one would assume it would be the other way around if PVP wasn't the central part of Herocraft.

Just out of curiosity what IS the hardcore part of herocraft? Not looking to start an argument or anything, just curious. The PVP aspect of the wild is the only hardcore aspect that I see. Especially with the tombstones and the teleports and all of the towns not allowing PVP ( I know this is up to the town, but still, of course they would never choose pvp enabled unless it was forced).

Like I said I'm new so pardon me if I'm getting something wrong.

 

[Kainzo]

We appeal to all spheres of game-play.

PVE
PVP
Social/Building.

PVP isn't an integral part of hardcore. It's an integral part of PVP. Hardcore means no freebies, no exits, no free teleports, no 'ez' modes, little to no safety nets, challenging gameplay etc, punishment for death, reward for staying alive - the list could go on.

We are not a "hardcore" PVP server, we are a HARDCORE server, which includes PVP but is not centered around it.

@Carmeops - we're removing the loss of COIN in favor of the XP penalty. It's already adjusted on the Test.

That being said - stay on topic.

 

[Kainzo]

How do you feel about the leveling?

We can increase the amount of levels and keep the amount of exp - we can spread out the skill gains (there will be 3-5 per class)

There's a lot of options.

 

[Raetac]

Leveling for Crafters seems ok, the xp gained for coal versus iron seems a bit out of wack (50 xp for coal and 10 for iron)

 

[Diavolo1988]

Some of my thoughts/facts concerning Derelicts talk about that PvP should be profitable:

First of all, there will be a "scrap market" where you can sell half broken armors and weapons. It will be all the smiths. They can repair the armors and sell them out again in their chest shop. You can already sell all the other loot, its called "/ch t".

An other thing about the PvP. I like how it used to be that people killed other players and took their stuff. Ive never done it, but I guess it was fun. What I think would be the best way to "reward" PvP and at the same time make it a bit more hardcore here, would be make it so you dont get a tombstone if you die from pvp.

 

[Steamed]

I have liked what I have seen so far but have not been on much. If there is something like this, tell me, but there should be a way to see what abilities you have and how to cast them. Im guessing that will be on the wiki or something.

---

Some of my thoughts/facts concerning Derelicts talk about that PvP should be profitable:

First of all, there will be a "scrap market" where you can sell half broken armors and weapons. It will be all the smiths. They can repair the armors and sell them out again in their chest shop. You can already sell all the other loot, its called "/ch t".

An other thing about the PvP. I like how it used to be that people killed other players and took their stuff. Ive never done it, but I guess it was fun. What I think would be the best way to "reward" PvP and at the same time make it a bit more hardcore here, would be make it so you dont get a tombstone if you die from pvp.

ooh a scrap market! are you suggesting that or is it forsure? I also agree with your tombstone idea

 

[Kainzo]

You can do /skill - for that info

 

[eljimbobo]

So I've only played a little bit on the server, but I feel like leveling up is going to be pretty difficult. I made a warrior and even after farming in the arena for an hour I was only level 3, not enough for my first skill. I don't know what you're aiming for with time required to reach max level, but especially as a warrior whose only form of EXP gain is killing mobs (and players?) it seems like the leveling is taking a long time and the rewards are not worth the investment.

Also, it would be nice if there was a /help skill [skill name] or something that described what the skill does and its mana cost.

 

[awesomerest]

I was thinking that there should be more between lvl 5 and lvl 20. I know there probably will be in the future. I was think more along the lines of only wood tools till lvl 3 then you get one stone tool. At lvl 5 it adds another stone tool and so on. Each class could be different but have maybe not each lvl give something but every other lvl or third lvl. I noticed after reaching lvl 5 with warrior and learning jump I just said screw it to the other lvls. I also think that the amount of xp needed should be more. I don't want to cap out in a week and then I have nothing to move towards. Also every class should be able to use every item eventually. Those are some of my thoughts. Some of these may not be possible or have been brought to your attention or are in the works already.

 

[rattmodriguez]

Okay after playing heroes for 5 days here are a few of my thoughts.

Killing mobs for xp has become very boring. I think all classes should gain xp for mining and farming, even if it is a fraction of a xp point. I think maybe .1 xp per block wouldnt been bad.

 

[Adam]

Simply said, I like where this is going.

 

[Kainzo]

K - here's the run down while I have a bit of a break between moving.

Leveling - we want it to take 3-7 days for someone to get through their first PATH (war/rog/mag etc) -Then to max their specialization - it will take another 3-7 days. So if you were to master every single class - it will take somewhere between 1-3 months - depending how hard core you play.

Please note that these aren't 'necessary' to enjoy the game to it's fullest - we'll try to have a crafting class that can use diamond tools so those who don't want to RPG will be happy with what they have, however... If you want to gain skills and abilities - it must be done through HARDWORK and TIME.

More skills are coming in and being spread out from 1 to 20 - we may choose to axe the first level abilities and push them to level 5 - why would you just get an ability "just" for being level 1 of your specialization? psh!

MORE EXP SOURCES: some ones that are coming in - CRAFTING EXP (For the crafters) - and of course - we're looking at having HEALING EXP.

Also we MAY choose to have the first 5 PATHS be able to level through mining and the specializations soley on SLaying/etc.

There will be a TIP command in command to tell you what a skill does.
Anyways - I hope you guys are enjoying it - we're not out to make it a grind fest.

 

[Steamed]

K - here's the run down while I have a bit of a break between moving.

Leveling - we want it to take 3-7 days for someone to get through their first PATH (war/rog/mag etc) -Then to max their specialization - it will take another 3-7 days. So if you were to master every single class - it will take somewhere between 1-3 months - depending how hard core you play.

Please note that these aren't 'necessary' to enjoy the game to it's fullest - we'll try to have a crafting class that can use diamond tools so those who don't want to RPG will be happy with what they have, however... If you want to gain skills and abilities - it must be done through HARDWORK and TIME.

More skills are coming in and being spread out from 1 to 20 - we may choose to axe the first level abilities and push them to level 5 - why would you just get an ability "just" for being level 1 of your specialization? psh!

MORE EXP SOURCES: some ones that are coming in - CRAFTING EXP (For the crafters) - and of course - we're looking at having HEALING EXP.

Also we MAY choose to have the first 5 PATHS be able to level through mining and the specializations soley on SLaying/etc.

There will be a TIP command in command to tell you what a skill does.
Anyways - I hope you guys are enjoying it - we're not out to make it a grind fest.

so someone can be every class? im not sure what you mean by "master every single class".
But the rest of it seems cool

 

[Malphugus]

Have mastered a crafter, mastered engineer, and started on the rogue path. I'm pretty happy with the crafter levelling. A couple of things that don't seem quite right to me:

a) Diamond weapons. Don't think any crafting specializations should get these. Tools yes, but leave the weapons to the fighter-types.
This would encourage crafters to either befriend/hire protectors or to also level up a combat path.

b) Leveling crafter wasn't bad. Took around 2, fairly active, days. Leveling engineer was significantly faster - due to having diamond tools. I'd reduce the mining exp for the specialties that have diamond tools (though this might change with the introduction of crafting exp)

c) leveling through slaying is significantly harder, or at least more costly (as you need armor and food) I don't like the idea of having all specialisations level through slaying. Crafters should have the option of avoiding combat altogether.
An alternative suggestion: allow all paths to level via mining and slaying exp (and other appropriate sources like: healing for healers / crafting for crafters / pvp kills for warriors&rogues).
But restrict the sources for specializations (no slaying exp for crafter specializations / no mining exp for warrior,rogue and healer specializations)
Personally I'd like to see the initial path mastered faster than the specialization. Say 2-4 days for the path and 6-10 days for the specialization.

Also, if it's not too much work/too hard to track: space out the benefits. Just to keep the leveling interesting.
e.g. on mastering crafter you don't immediately get full iron armor. instead you get say iron helm, then at lvl3 specialization: iron boots, level6=iron leggings, level9=iron breastplate. Similarly for the diamond tools (hoe, then spade, then axe, then pick).

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so someone can be every class? im not sure what you mean by "master every single class".
But the rest of it seems cool

I'm unclear on how that is intended to work too. At the moment it looks like you can master every path and also every specialization (one at a time) but you can only BE one path or specialization.
i.e. You could mastery every specialization but can currently be "A master Ninja" OR "A master Blacksmith", you couldn't have the benefits of both specializations at the same time.

How easy/hard will it be to change path/specialization?
What will happen to chest shops & ICs you created if you swap from a crafter path/specialization to something else?