Suggestion [General]Region Abuse Consequence

[Angyles]

Also remember the server works on the step system as posted here http://www.herocraftonline.com/wiki/index.php/Category:Rules
Enforcement

• Warnings will be given for any infringement as follows.
  • First warning: Player receives a warning.
  • Second warning: Player receives a 3-day suspension.
  • Third warning: Player receives a 1-week suspension.
  • Fourth warning: Player receives a 1-month suspension.
  • Fifth warning: Player receives a permanent ban.

Except the rules also state this at the top of the page:

Server staff retain the right to kick, ban, or close access to any or all users of Herocraft Online Services at any time. The rules are constantly being updated, check back often.

So the step system is not always followed.

 

[MrAwesomeShadow]

If they had their levels taken from them it would push them away from HC, who wants to lose all the work they did before. The way you described region abuse makes me think its a very common thing so if all them people left i doubt it would be to good for the server. Also remember the server works on the step system as posted here http://www.herocraftonline.com/wiki/index.php/Category:Rules
Enforcement

• Warnings will be given for any infringement as follows.
  • First warning: Player receives a warning.
  • Second warning: Player receives a 3-day suspension.
  • Third warning: Player receives a 1-week suspension.
  • Fourth warning: Player receives a 1-month suspension.
  • Fifth warning: Player receives a permanent ban.

Aside from what Angyles said, I'm sure most of us already know what the rules are here and there's really no need to quote them and most of the standard protocols seem to not be followed and the punishment is determined by staff from the intensity of the crime. If they had their levels taken from them if they did this, then it would push them away from, not the server, but abusing regions. Of course, who would want all their work lost, if this punishment was in place it would discourage breaking these rules.

 

[judgedread540]

Aside from what Angyles said, I'm sure most of us already know what the rules are here and there's really no need to quote them and most of the standard protocols seem to not be followed and the punishment is determined by staff from the intensity of the crime. If they had their levels taken from them if they did this, then it would push them away from, not the server, but abusing regions. Of course, who would want all their work lost, if this punishment was in place it would discourage breaking these rules.

I just think losing a long times work is harsh i think losing levels should be a punishment reserved for spawners/dark rooms etc... Also if you lost all your levels what do you do now? Level up again? That sounds pointless and boring and would make the server less fun and i hope that isnt what kain aims to do

 

[MrAwesomeShadow]

I just think losing a long times work is harsh i think losing levels should be a punishment reserved for spawners/dark rooms etc... Also if you lost all your levels what do you do now? Level up again? That sounds pointless and boring and would make the server less fun and i hope that isnt what kain aims to do

Giving you the benefit of the doubt that you're not going to abuse regions...what punishment do you consider judge?

 

[kevinlive]

Lorien as a whole has been cleared out twice this map, each time it happened we didn't have a single piece of cobble after it happened. Everything was opened by town members and left to be raided. It happens Leftovers, you don't see us crying because of it.

What if I tell you, this is the 6th time someone abuses regions to get into Obl?
And what if I tell you, 5 of those times TC/Lorien was involved? Our whole fucking point is, get banned already.
Also, bribing new members to turn on us..

 

[judgedread540]

Giving you the benefit of the doubt that you're not going to abuse regions...what punishment do you consider judge?

Longer ban and all items you got while abusing regions should be taken.

I like punisments to relate to the crime like i said levels wiped for dark rooms, so maybe all the items that belong to the player are taken and destroyed or even given to the player that had their regions abused ( That doesnt really follow the hardcore concept but oh well its a suggestion )

I do agree with the money wipe though, who knows if they abused regions before stole a ton of gold, sold it and weren't caught

 

[judgedread540]

What if I tell you, this is the 6th time someone abuses regions to get into Obl?
And what if I tell you, 5 of those times TC/Lorien was involved? Our whole fucking point is, get banned already.
Also, bribing new members to turn on us..

Multiple offences of the same type should always be ban in my opinion, lesser punishments should only be for first time offences. I am unsure on what should happen if a different person from the same group abuse to get inside.

 

[MrAwesomeShadow]

Longer ban and all items you got while abusing regions should be taken.

I like punisments to relate to the crime like i said levels wiped for dark rooms, so maybe all the items that belong to the player are taken and destroyed or even given to the player that had their regions abused ( That doesnt really follow the hardcore concept but oh well its a suggestion )

I do agree with the money wipe though, who knows if they abused regions before stole a ton of gold, sold it and weren't caught

There's an even larger flaw to that. How would they know you actually kept the items rather than throw it into lava? Not everything has to relate to the crime, just has to relate to the players.

 

[judgedread540]

There's an even larger flaw to that. How would they know you actually kept the items rather than throw it into lava? Not everything has to relate to the crime, just has to relate to the players.

True, I guess you've got me there.

 

[MajorasMask]

In terms of what @c12095 has said, yes, region abuse DOES happen, but that doesn't make it right. We've seen many towns on this map die after they've been ''cleaned'' by rogue players. Take the Communist Collective for example, nearly 100% ruined after it was raided. Even when WeeWoo raided Lorien with Zihara and Hanpeter, I definitly did see a major decrease in that town's activity after that. This is why we believe there should be stricter punishments regarding the whole situation.

In my eyes, coin and level wipes are perfectly reasonable. Banishments too, as i've said, should be determined, by an admin (or admins if it is serious enough), on the severity of the abuse (lets not get crazy and ban someone for stealing 2 cooked porkchops from a covered chest ).

 

[Angyles]

Do you think the punishments should be the same for both exploiting regions, and abusing regions?

Exploiting - Some random person finds a way in through a block exploit
Abusing - Someone with permissions opening the town for others to raid

 

[Jonsoon]

Do you think the punishments should be the same for both exploiting regions, and abusing regions?

Exploiting - Some random person finds a way in through a block exploit
Abusing - Someone with permissions opening the town for others to raid

No. Exploiting is breaking the server rules.
Abusing is breaking rules of said region.

IMO, people need to be more careful about who they add to their regions. My DG plot has been wiped three times. Twice from people exploiting and I was pissed, and one time from a IRL friend who I got in a fight with. I was not nearly as mad because it was my own fault for having him on the regions.

 

[MajorasMask]

No. Exploiting is breaking the server rules.
Abusing is breaking rules of said region.

IMO, people need to be more careful about who they add to their regions. My DG plot has been wiped three times. Twice from people exploiting and I was pissed, and one time from a IRL friend who I got in a fight with. I was not nearly as mad because it was my own fault for having him on the regions.

The ''Be more careful'' arguement is pointless, how the hell are you going to know who is going to abuse the regions?

Do you think the punishments should be the same for both exploiting regions, and abusing regions?

Exploiting - Some random person finds a way in through a block exploit
Abusing - Someone with permissions opening the town for others to raid

In my eyes, punishments should vary depending on how severe the ''crime'' was.

 

[eagles90809]

Kainzo, and all staff, have said many times that regions are NOT for protecting chests, and the only 100% sure way to protect your items are LWCs. You cannot depend on regions for protecting your items.
However, in this case I will agree with some of you who have posted, item reimbursement is something I've wanted for awhile. But, again there are some things that sound good, but in practice aren't. Returning items is a slippery slope, you do it for someone, everyone expects it, and, as Itzmak said, it's easy to exploit. How do you prove they aren't just trying to double their loot?

As for punishments, @Brutalacerate is looking into all that, and I have faith he'll make things better.

Really sucks what happened to you guys, it happened to me 2 times, once in Rangpur and once in XXXmasTown. The towns were wiped clean, no items were returned. It's not easy to move on, but you'll get back to where you were before all this eventually, and if you ever want help collecting resources, give me a shout, I got nothin better to do 8)

If you have nothing better to do, help your guild MA, we need you.

 

[alexhoff1]

Think of it this way,

MONEY WIPE - you loose all of your progress, I know people who have quit when this happened to them. - this should be reserved if they got like 50% of there cash from the abuse, if not it's like OH HEY! we will punish you like 8 times over what you abused! Which is an extreme solution to a fairly obvious problem. (all they have to do is block log :L)
LEVELS WIPE - I could see this, though roughly 20 hours of leveling loss for maybe 10 hours stolen in item value, money loss would be more fair.
BAN - obviously this is a good solution, a LONG ban would solve a lot. (I agree for once...)


You guys are being a bit.. irrational? You just experienced betrayal involving money for the first time. It happens all the time, every other day, just a factor in the game.
(LIVE WITH IT, he's being punished currently.)

 

[Barnubus]

@Brutalacerate

 

[MajorasMask]

Think of it this way,

MONEY WIPE - you loose all of your progress, I know people who have quit when this happened to them. - this should be reserved if they got like 50% of there cash from the abuse, if not it's like OH HEY! we will punish you like 8 times over what you abused! Which is an extreme solution to a fairly obvious problem. (all they have to do is block log :L)
LEVELS WIPE - I could see this, though roughly 20 hours of leveling loss for maybe 10 hours stolen in item value, money loss would be more fair.
BAN - obviously this is a good solution, a LONG ban would solve a lot. (I agree for once...)


You guys are being a bit.. irrational? You just experienced betrayal involving money for the first time. It happens all the time, every other day, just a factor in the game.
(LIVE WITH IT, he's being punished currently.)

I, and many others, see it as this: If you don't want to lose all your levels, all your coins, and to then get banned for a long time, DON'T break the rules (''Don't want it; don't do it''). The arguement that people will ''leave'' once they break rules (like region abuse) is just silly, why the hell would we want rule breakers on this server? As we've said before, punishments would be considered first by an admin depending on how severe the rule breaking was.

In addition, yes, region abuse DOES happen a lot, but that isn't a reason to justify doing it, to shorten/weaken the punishments to those who do it or just to ignore it in general. The whole point of this thread is to request better punishments for those who abuse regions, other than just weekly-monthly bans that we see now.

In terms of Diffuse, we already know this. Read what i've said above; this thread isn't a place to bash Diffuse, it's a place to request a change.

 

[Dsawemd]

Throwing out a -1 for losing levels, that's the one punishment that will kill the server, if we make newer/stupider players do the grind again. Also, I know HC rewards those who spend a lot of time on it, but if we ever need a boost to player base, we could make it a slightly shorter grind. Really looking forward to fun quest xp.

Region abuse sucks, so why not recquire that every town have an open public entrance? Would require mayor lwc's though. More pvp, focus on towns, could be implemented after the #of towns is reduced.

 

[Barnubus]

Throwing out a -1 for losing levels, that's the one punishment that will kill the server, if we make newer/stupider players do the grind again.

I disagree.
As Majoras and others have stated before, it wont get rid of the player base, it'll only get rid of those players we don't want here.
If you break a rule as serious as this, to erase months of work a player has done, you need to work damn hard to prove you deserve to come back, and have learned your lesson. Why would we make it easy on them, just because we want numbers?
I would rather have fewer yet more honest/better players then more rule breakers.

 

[MixxiM]

On the topic of using an alternate account. It is ridiculously easy to determine what IP an account logs in at, there are numerous plugins that do so. If an account logs in from the same IP as another player, and the reason is not stated elsewhere (e.g. 'Its my brother'), the account should be considered an alternate and banned ASAP pending investigation. Am I the only one that remembers that alts are illegal?

Just my two cents, hope it helps