Suggestion Disciple vs Ranger Melee, Why Disciple Nerfed?

[malikdanab]

Srry forgot to say this earlier....
If we want to play the support shouldn't do this much damage game lets take a look at bard....
(From wiki)
Bard does 60 damage per hit....
has a heal.... (not that great but can be good if u kite with it)
2 silences.....
warsong...
accelerando...

All of those are support skills FYI. Also, bard's melee got nerfed from 60 to 50 on test.

 

[JupiterRome]

All of those are support skills FYI. Also, bard's melee got nerfed from 60 to 50 on test.

but they make bard a very strong class
voidsong + kick + accelerando + melodicbindings = shit on healers/casters
bow + envenom+ warsong= Can keep warriors far away and make warsong rival the warrior/rogues damage and be able to silence + dps skills and do pretty good.

Im just giving another example of another VERY STRONG "SUPPORT" Class shitting on others in 1v1.... changing healer to support isn't a good idea imo because it means all those healers shouldn't be able to solo to most people... Disciple isn't support malik sorry to tell you but tbh I think @TrueCorruptor would agree with me too. (only calling him out because hes like best disciple and most expiranced disciple ive seen on server tbh)

eidt* people I want seeing this thread

@BaBomba @MichaelRL @yeelowsnow @Wild_Porygon
XD post on my profile if im missing anyone else who plays disciple a lot

 

[malikdanab]

but they make bard a very strong class
voidsong + kick + accelerando + melodicbindings = shit on healers/casters
bow + envenom+ warsong= Can keep warriors far away and make warsong rival the warrior/rogues damage and be able to silence + dps skills and do pretty good.

Im just giving another example of another VERY STRONG "SUPPORT" Class shitting on others in 1v1.... changing healer to support isn't a good idea imo because it means all those healers shouldn't be able to solo to most people... Disciple isn't support malik sorry to tell you but tbh I think @TrueCorruptor would agree with me too. (only calling him out because hes like best disciple and most expiranced disciple ive seen on server tbh)

eidt* people I want seeing this thread

@BaBomba @MichaelRL @yeelowsnow @Wild_Porygon
XD post on my profile if im missing anyone else who plays disciple a lot

Disciple isn't a support atm and I have never said it is. All I said is that MAYBE they plan on changing disciple to a support class.

 

[Egorh]

Disciple has some support abilities, chakra works better on allies than it does yourself. Balance can be very useful in the right situation. Fist of Jin is small aoe healing. Although it has these I don't think it is a 'support'. But then again you could think of these skills as support: Ironfist, forcepull, forcepush. They are not heavy damage skills but utility skills that could be used for peeling and controlling the battle field

 

[JupiterRome]

Disciple has some support abilities, chakra works better on allies than it does yourself. Balance can be very useful in the right situation. Fist of Jin is small aoe healing. Although it has these I don't think it is a 'support'. But then again you could think of these skills as support: Ironfist, forcepull, forcepush. They are not heavy damage skills but utility skills that could be used for peeling and controlling the battle field

Your Right I didn't mean it has no Support I meant it has more solo ability then support, I mean I use balance a lot and forcepush/pull can help allies but I think disciple is more soloist then supporter

 

[JupiterRome]

And on the topic about the "support" tree arnt bard and beguiler supposed to br support? Cuz I mean they both have such low dps

 

[Dsawemd]

/hero whois JupiterRome

 

[pure_autism]

Are you really complaining about disciples left click dmg? Disciples base dmg with a blaze rod is 50 dmg, higher than any other warrior class besides dragoon which is basically the left click class of the game ( other than ninja and rune blade.

Just so you know, Disciple's melee only goes up to about 58 now. Paladin has less, but it's a tank and shouldn't have melee on par with Disciple. DreadKnight's thing is having magic damage, so it doesn't need very high left-click damage. Berserker has about 57, but can be increased to reach 100 damage per hit. And as you hopefully know, Dragoon has its Rogue-Melee because of its lore. Only half of the Warriors have melee worse than Disciple's, and for good reason. Warriors are not DPS classes (You must have them confused with Rogues), and they are definitely a lot tanker than any Disciple. Don't forget that every Warrior has higher damage than Disciple, even Paladin due to its stun with an incredibly short cool down.

Disciple NEEDS to have the melee it has, because it had terrible skill damage.

Also, it seems lately that you've made it your goal to fight with AD members, always going off-topic to start a flame war. Can we not have ONE thread that doesn't include you and an AD member arguing?

inb4Facepalm

 

[Avoir]

Just so you know, Disciple's melee only goes up to about 58 now. Paladin has less, but it's a tank and shouldn't have melee on par with Disciple. DreadKnight's thing is having magic damage, so it doesn't need very high left-click damage. Berserker has about 57, but can be increased to reach 100 damage per hit. And as you hopefully know, Dragoon has its Rogue-Melee because of its lore. Only half of the Warriors have melee worse than Disciple's, and for good reason. Warriors are not DPS classes (You must have them confused with Rogues), and they are definitely a lot tanker than any Disciple. Don't forget that every Warrior has higher damage than Disciple, even Paladin due to its stun with an incredibly short cool down.

Disciple NEEDS to have the melee it has, because it had terrible skill damage.

Also, it seems lately that you've made it your goal to fight with AD members, always going off-topic to start a flame war. Can we not have ONE thread that doesn't include you and an AD member arguing?

inb4Facepalm

Bring out some actual facts please from the wiki and the game for the dmg and skills, I'm not flaming you should learn the definition of the word and bomba I don't know why you're in this thread since half the time you start any argument on the server.

 

[Evanist]

Everyone arguing about disciple damage and such.... Well here the thing... I know people might not agree with this but here goes: Disciple is more of a healer/ tank then what people think, even if ti has pretty bad armor. It's fist of jin add extra heal to itself, the forcepush permits you to cast replenish... Balance permits you to keep up with your party and heal them up if they are too low hp. Basically, even if Disciple damage is rather low, it is NOT made to be a pure dps/healer. It has enough damage to actually do sometihng, and with fire aspect, you get enough to do something about. They are support as well as a extra control class.

I will say this: Yes the skills should be fixed for quivering palm and sharpness on blaze rods, but it already has some acceptable damage. What it would need more is EXTRA armor points. This will make it that they would be more acceptable in fights against rogues and such, instead of having some face stomping happening. I fought with Disciple before, and I was a Pyromancer. A good disciple can actually solo pretty good. It does not need a damage boost, even if Ranger melee is rather high. But let's face it: Ranger IS a rogue class that has NOTHING to actually support their team. Disciple has skills for this. So ya... I know people might get annoyed by this but... I feel as if damage wise Disicple is ok, and that it only needs skills fixed and a bit more defense. It is a healer first, then a partially tank, then a dps. Yes I would like it to have maybe some more damage for a bit of skills, but not for the melee damage. Forcepull and push should have a bit more damage in my opinion, but that just me.

 

[JupiterRome]

/hero whois JupiterRome

Point? Yeah I'm not gunna sit here and agree a ranged 200 damage per shot class should do the same melee damage as classes who rely on melee, dude trying out ranger I could pretty much just melee and kill a pyro (which has awesome damage and is a caster with better melee and more armor then disciple)

Just so you know, Disciple's melee only goes up to about
58 now. Paladin has less, but it's a tank and shouldn't have melee on par with Disciple. DreadKnight's thing is having magic damage, so it doesn't
need very high left-click damage. Berserker has about 57, but can be increased to reach 100 damage per
hit. And as you hopefully know, Dragoon has its Rogue-Melee because of its lore. Only half of the Warriors
have melee worse than Disciple's, and for good reason. Warriors are not DPS classes (You must have them confused with Rogues), and they are definitely
a lot tanker than any Disciple. Don't forget that every Warrior has higher damage than Disciple, even Paladin
due to its stun with an incredibly short cool down.


Disciple NEEDS to have the melee it
has, because it had terrible skill damage.

Also, it seems lately that you've made
it your goal to fight with AD members, always going off-topic to start a flame war. Can we not have ONE thread that doesn't include you and an AD member arguing?

inb4Facepalm

Tbh he's not targeting ad members me and franky pvp together a lot and he still argued with me wish I could qoute posts from first page on iPod but gotta due whole new posy

 

[JupiterRome]

Everyone arguing about disciple damage and such.... Well here the thing... I know people might not agree with this but here
goes: Disciple is more of a healer/ tank then what people think, even if ti has pretty bad armor. It's fist of jin

add extra heal to itself, the forcepush permits you to cast replenish... Balance permits you to keep up with your party and heal them up if they
are too low hp. Basically,
even if Disciple damage is rather low, it is NOT made to be a pure dps/healer. It has enough damage to actually do sometihng, and with fire aspect, you get enough to do something about. They are
support as well as a extra control class.
I will say this: Yes the skills should

good disciple can actually solo pretty good. It does not need a damage boost, even if Ranger melee is rather high. But let's face it: Ranger IS a rogue class that has NOTHING to actually support their team. Disciple has skills for this. So ya... I know people might get annoyed by this but... I feel as
if damage wise Disicple is ok, and that it only needs skills fixed and a bit more defense. It is a healer first, then a
partially tank, then a dps. Yes I would like it to have maybe some more damage for a bit of skills, but not for the melee
damage. Forcepull and push should have a bit more damage in my opinion, but
that just me.

god I hate quoting on iPod, but disciple is tanker then people think against casters not meleecuz honestly disciple has rogue hp warrior damage and lost soul armor which is stupi, disciple isn't that tanky

 

[JupiterRome]

It might be because fire damage on blazerods is pretty strong and viable for disciples. Pretty sure the diamond vs gold tool thing
applies to all rogues for all healers.

For the fire aspect thing, does that mean we can balance dk off my sharp 12 axe or paladin off my sharp ten sword

 

[Dsawemd]

The point of /hero whois JupiterRome comment...

I am snarkily casting doubt on Your reasons for this passionate defense of disciple.

@JupiterRome We all know that you were an excellent Druid, and that Ire's warmup on Test (etc.) may have you looking for a new class that is close to your playstyle (heal class played with particular emphasis on offensive). And if that IS the case, I am suggesting that this thread and some of your responses in it are biased. Do you think they are or could be?

Edit: If yes, consider working to be more unbiased. That's all!

 

[JupiterRome]

The point of /hero whois JupiterRome comment...

I am snarkily casting doubt on Your reasons for this passionate defense of disciple.

@JupiterRome We all know that you were an excellent Druid, and that Ire's warmup on Test (etc.) may have you looking for a new class that is close to your playstyle (heal class played with particular emphasis on offensive). And if that IS the case, I am suggesting that this thread and some of your responses in it are biased. Do you think they are or could be?

Edit: If yes, consider working to be more unbiased. That's all!

Ask @AdamForte649 or @Trazil I was shiting on people with ires warm up.... I actually like it, makes the class less boring, just don't like having damage limited by cool downs (even if low) if you knew me you would know the classes I actually played last map were, Mystic,Disciple,Ranger,Wizard,Beguiler,Paladin, And Bloodmage... all did lots of damage....

And on the Topic of Disciple shaman does 47 melee damage and has the around the same healing with more damage and armor weight (I think)

@Dsawemd if you wanna talk about druid Im gunna tell you I think balance did horrible on nerfing it, it didn't hit any of the key points, can some of you plz play druid so that you know why its op.
edit* By Shitting on I mean like 3v1ing beguilers without healing at all or just a little bit

 

[malikdanab]

Until entangle gets a warm-up, it will be a pretty OP skill. And lets not even get started on it's range...

 

[Trazil]

Until entangle gets a warm-up, it will be a pretty OP skill.

entangle just needs a longer cooldown really

 

[JupiterRome]

Until entangle gets a warm-up, it will be a pretty OP skill.

kk wth does that have to do with anything? If its about druid just gunna say I play druid/beguiler rlly weird and don't use entangle/piggify/mass piggify

 

[JupiterRome]

entangle just needs a longer cooldown really

I VOTE BOTH
#FUCKWIZARD2014

 

[malikdanab]

kk wth does that have to do with anything? If its about druid just gunna say I play druid/beguiler rlly weird and don't use entangle/piggify/mass piggify

You wanted someone to point out why druid is op...