Suggestion Beguiler Changes

[PewPewPewLasers]

It's early into the map, and I am currently the highest level beguiler. Right now, I feel like the class has a couple of pros which are matched with some pretty hefty cons, which is why I'm making this post - to fully balance the class. So, let's begin.

What makes beguiler strong right now? (Note that all of this is considering the server is running at optimal speed)

-Strong burst on a relatively low cooldown
-Strong, reliable forms of CC
-Surprisingly tanky, over 900 hp with over 5 bars of protection (hopefully going to be nerfed)
-Strong ability to kite, natural knockback on hero skills helps this a lot

What are some of the weaknesses of beguiler? (Assuming the serving is running at optimal speed)
-Mana issues. Missing a spell takes a huge chunk of your mana, and the regen isn't high enough to recover mana from a skill not landing or registering (coughmotherfuckingfireballnotworkingcough)
-Very easy to kill with hard CC

As it stands, mana is a HUGE problem for beguiler. Without clarity up, you regen 3% of your mana every 5 seconds(?), which as you can tell is horrendously slow. Clarity currently costs 15% of your mana to use, which means if you forget to keep it up when you're going into a fight you either need to wait a long time for your mana to come back, or you need to use 15% of your precious mana to get more mana every few seconds. Realistically, it's the start of the map; there is lag. I'm not complaining, as I know that it's bound to happen, but it sometimes makes it very difficult to get your skills off. As a beguiler if the server is lagging your damage output is VERY inconsistent, seeing as all your skills are heavily affected by lag.

I feel that beguiler needs to better fit the role of a utility mage. Currently it does a lot of damage considering the kit it has. Here are my recommended changes for beguiler.

-Reduce Piggify cooldown by 5s
-Reduce MassPiggify cooldown by 10s
-Reduce Fireball damage by 15, increase cooldown by 2
-Reduce Pulse damage by 10, increase cooldown by 2
-Replace Chaoticvisions with Plaguebomb - deals 130 damage and causes a nausea effect for 2 seconds. Costs 235 mana with a 15 second cooldown, reagent rotten flesh
-Reduce Clarity mana cost to 45
-Replace Purge with consume, consuming a bone restores 100 mana on a 45 second cooldown
-Increase Quantumleap cooldown by 10 seconds but remove the reagent
-Increase the base mana regen by 25

I feel that these changes will really help the quality of life for the class and help shape its identity better, dealing less damage with more consistent crowd control to excel in teamfights while hindering its soloing ability slightly.

 

[peterpunx]

[USERGROUP=38]@Balance Team[/USERGROUP]

I think the 55 armor is not something that needs to be nerfed, it needs to be fixed, dont think its supposed to be like that. (Probably just the max equipment weight is not working properly)

Beguilers already had mana issues last map, low mana regen because you are supposed to have clarity up all the time. The problem is that clarity cost way too much mana. I would go with reducing the mana cost of clarity to 0. Maybe increase the CD to 1min (not even needed)

About the damage, make the same for all fireballs, all pulses,..
That would be reduce beguiler fireball damage to 90+1.5 int (actual is 90+1.75)
reduce beguiler pulse mana cost to 115 (actual is 150)


Agree with Piggify CD reduction to 20sec (actual 25)
Disagree with increasing base mana regen, consume, masspiggify cd reduction

 

[lordprettyflack0]

It's early into the map, and I am currently the highest level beguiler. Right now, I feel like the class has a couple of pros which are matched with some pretty hefty cons, which is why I'm making this post - to fully balance the class. So, let's begin.

What makes beguiler strong right now? (Note that all of this is considering the server is running at optimal speed)

-Strong burst on a relatively low cooldown
-Strong, reliable forms of CC
-Surprisingly tanky, over 900 hp with over 5 bars of protection (hopefully going to be nerfed)
-Strong ability to kite, natural knockback on hero skills helps this a lot

What are some of the weaknesses of beguiler? (Assuming the serving is running at optimal speed)
-Mana issues. Missing a spell takes a huge chunk of your mana, and the regen isn't high enough to recover mana from a skill not landing or registering (coughmotherfuckingfireballnotworkingcough)
-Very easy to kill with hard CC

As it stands, mana is a HUGE problem for beguiler. Without clarity up, you regen 3% of your mana every 5 seconds(?), which as you can tell is horrendously slow. Clarity currently costs 15% of your mana to use, which means if you forget to keep it up when you're going into a fight you either need to wait a long time for your mana to come back, or you need to use 15% of your precious mana to get more mana every few seconds. Realistically, it's the start of the map; there is lag. I'm not complaining, as I know that it's bound to happen, but it sometimes makes it very difficult to get your skills off. As a beguiler if the server is lagging your damage output is VERY inconsistent, seeing as all your skills are heavily affected by lag.

I feel that beguiler needs to better fit the role of a utility mage. Currently it does a lot of damage considering the kit it has. Here are my recommended changes for beguiler.

-Reduce Piggify cooldown by 5s
-Reduce MassPiggify cooldown by 10s
-Reduce Fireball damage by 15, increase cooldown by 2
-Reduce Pulse damage by 10, increase cooldown by 2
-Replace Chaoticvisions with Plaguebomb - deals 130 damage and causes a nausea effect for 2 seconds. Costs 235 mana with a 15 second cooldown, reagent rotten flesh
-Reduce Clarity mana cost to 45
-Replace Purge with consume, consuming a bone restores 100 mana on a 45 second cooldown
-Increase Quantumleap cooldown by 10 seconds but remove the reagent
-Increase the base mana regen by 25

I feel that these changes will really help the quality of life for the class and help shape its identity better, dealing less damage with more consistent crowd control to excel in teamfights while hindering its soloing ability slightly.

soo this is my hit on it since I was beguiler last 3 maps

I like what pewpew is going here, I think its perfect with all his suggestions, little touch ups though

the 130 dmg with a 15 cd plaguebomb really takes down beguilers kite skill, I think it should be a 10-12 second cd

I completely agree with quantumleaps new idea

Basically a perfect way to fix beuiler, except too many people are going to complain about piggify and masspiggify with the cooldowns

 

[Trazil]

Plaguebomb plz

 

[PewPewPewLasers]

@unknownloner , I know you've been working on Heromod if I'm not mistaken. Is there a way to trigger a timer for 3 minutes (whatever the duration is) when clarity is used to see how long you have left on it?

 

[MajDeath]

@unknownloner , I know you've been working on Heromod if I'm not mistaken. Is there a way to trigger a timer for 3 minutes (whatever the duration is) when clarity is used to see how long you have left on it?

It would be great to see how much time all buffs and debuffs on you have left.
Possibility to use /skill scan on other players to see what buffs and debuffs they have on?

 

[MariusAbyssal]

Why not set up your own timers? I actually used to have a clarity timer on my beguiler even last map. You don't need a change to heromod for this, though it would be a nice quality of life improvement.

 

[MajDeath]

Why not set up your own timers? I actually used to have a clarity timer on my beguiler even last map. You don't need a change to heromod for this, though it would be a nice quality of life improvement.

Pretty sure you can't set up timers for buffs or debuffs put on you by other players, and you definitely can't check the buffs and debuffs on another player any way.

 

[CoolBeans279]

@unknownloner , I know you've been working on Heromod if I'm not mistaken. Is there a way to trigger a timer for 3 minutes (whatever the duration is) when clarity is used to see how long you have left on it?

Pretty sure you can do this with macros, ask white.

 

[MariusAbyssal]

Pretty sure you can't set up timers for buffs or debuffs put on you by other players, and you definitely can't check the buffs and debuffs on another player any way.

As CoolBeans mentioned, you can do it with macros. I will not go into the details of how it's done here since there are other threads on the forum where it's explained. You can do a timer for anything that gives a chat message when it's applied on you, be it cast by yourself or another player.

 

[MajDeath]

As CoolBeans mentioned, you can do it with macros. I will not go into the details of how it's done here since there are other threads on the forum where it's explained. You can do a timer for anything that gives a chat message when it's applied on you, be it cast by yourself or another player.

and again... checking OTHER PEOPLES stats and buffs that are on THEM, I don't want to macro all this stuff and have 100+ buffs and debuffs things going on. /skill scan could be better if it could do that >.>

 

[PewPewPewLasers]

@Balance Team

 

[TheAncientTeam]

Yeah, I've not played beguiler for too long and am only level 35 currently but my main issue with the class so far seems to be to do with mana. Having a nerf on damage but a way to gain back mana would be a huge benefit for the class since after about 15 seconds of using skills my mana is all about done, and with a slow mana gain of 5s it is terribly slow trying to even regain mana. Having the focus be more on cc and doing less damage but maintaining good mana would make this class far more usable. In it's current state it's mana causes the class to be nearly useless in a fight lasting longer than a minute

 

[MunchlaxHero]

@unknownloner , I know you've been working on Heromod if I'm not mistaken. Is there a way to trigger a timer for 3 minutes (whatever the duration is) when clarity is used to see how long you have left on it?

I can make a GUI for macros if you want