Balance report (Current HC) + Suggestions

[LightningCape]

@Kainzo Any ETA on when you'll give these balance changes a look? Ik you're busy with stuff but I was just wondering.

 

[Egorh]

Disciple Changes

Forcepull/push

• Change damage scaling to intellect
• Change physical damage to magic damage

Flyingkick

• Range no longer scales with agility
• Now scales with only strength

Alacrity

• Without a single skill scaling with agility it would be pretty pointless for disciple to have this
• @LightningCape mentioned removing Fist of Jin. I did not really understand why because it is the only thing that keeps Disciple's melee damage. Although if it was removed it would leave room for a more useful stat increasing skill
• Whenever you hit someone you gain a stack. Each stack would give you 1 strength and 1 intellect at a max of 10 stacks. If you don't attack someone for the next 5 seconds you start losing your stacks (1 stack a second)

Ironfist

• The skill is meh, it's CC purpose doesn't really do a whole lot and the main use would be for about 70 AOE damage (physical)
• New Ironfist: It would have the same knockback/slow it has right now but instead of going only once it does 3 pulses over 4 seconds. Once right as the skill is used then 2s then 4s. But the damage would be reduced to 20 damage per hit (only 60 total). Since this skill would be a channel it would give the user a slow while casting it (slow 1 or 2).
• The new ironfist would'nt be used for damage but to better displace the enemy

 

[Dsawemd]

Not sure if removing the combo change of 1. Remove alacrity from disciple and 2. Change Flying Kick's Range scaling to STR from AGI is favored by upper staff, it has been suggested before without getting in. I do think that your force push change would help prevent STR from becoming too high of a stat priority.
@Kainzo are you opposed to removing most agility from disciple builds?

 

[LightningCape]

@Kainzo would you know anything about Beguiler's plaguebomb being changed to bolt on live?

 

[Kainzo]

@Balance Team
Herocraft 5.30 will focus on the balance changes necessary, going to go through with a fine-tooth comb to see what we can change to make things better.

Please note: Balance Team's job is to not create or change existing skills unless its EASILY done via configuration.
We will not be making code changes based on BALANCE CHANGES unless a dev is ready and willing to make them.

 

[mikehk]

lower damage on shaman firetotem. I know it's one of the shaman's "few" damaging abilities, but it's damage is insanely high for a projectile that cant miss and has a decent range. shaman has some of the highest DPS in the server, and as a healer, it should be reduced.

this may seem like raging from the tourny on saturday, which is where i'm getting my info, but 200 damage per fireball that doesnt miss, not to mention it hits more than one target.

 

[0xNaomi]

Please note: Balance Team's job is to not create or change existing skills unless its EASILY done via configuration.
We will not be making code changes based on BALANCE CHANGES unless a dev is ready and willing to make them.

People are free to tag me if they wish. I'm up for changes depending on what they are, provided you're cool with them.

 

[Kainzo]

People are free to tag me if they wish. I'm up for changes depending on what they are, provided you're cool with them.

Lets get them totems 1x3 asap

 

[0xNaomi]

Lets get them totems 1x3 asap

Knew there was something you wanted... but a weekend at a con kinda robbed me of that memory.

 

[Kainzo]

Knew there was something you wanted... but a weekend at a con kinda robbed me of that memory.

Happens

 

[JupiterRome]

Druids Kiting is too strong, PLaying druid is way to easy atm, any decent druid can beat most classes 1v1 (unless it is silenced whole time or bursted down all the way)

 

[Dsawemd]

Beguiler needs a decision: If plaguebomb is safe to come back, does it remain as bread and butter, or are the control aspects of the class buffed?

How hard is resource management as a Runeblade? I have no experience with the class but if resource management is too easy then I think the class is in a very strong place.

Disciple, IronFist improved utility? FlyingKick losing agility scaling? Alacrity? Increase heals or Wisdom scaling?

If this thread is where we are talking about it, lets get start with a clear idea of what classes are being left alone so we can focus on which classes need work.

 

[Egorh]

Well, as kainzo stated he wants no new code. So a major beguiler rework (for now) if off the table.

 

[Dsawemd]

Well, as kainzo stated he wants no new code. So a major beguiler rework (for now) if off the table.

Halve the damage on Plaguebomb and lower Beguile's cooldown to 3 seconds. This would be a simplistic and annoying way to do it, but changing the role from AoE nuker to control is easily accomplishable with current skills, especially if 1. Piggify can come back in and 2. PlagueBomb cannot. Either way, we could do it.

 

[Egorh]

Halve the damage on Plaguebomb and lower Beguile's cooldown to 3 seconds. This would be a simplistic and annoying way to do it, but changing the role from AoE nuker to control is easily accomplishable with current skills, especially if 1. Piggify can come back in and 2. PlagueBomb cannot. Either way, we could do it.

Cutting their main damage skill in half is a bit too much. I believe we should reduce the damage but not by half. The way I was hoping for would be to have it do so much initial damage and then a DoT. And then increase the cooldown on plague bomb

Edit: I don't think anything good will come from putting beguile on a 3 second CD. It will just end up being an infinite kite in a 1v1. "Ok, beguile is done, another beguile" repeat.

 

[mikehk]

Beguiler needs a decision: If plaguebomb is safe to come back, does it remain as bread and butter, or are the control aspects of the class buffed?

How hard is resource management as a Runeblade? I have no experience with the class but if resource management is too easy then I think the class is in a very strong place.

Disciple, IronFist improved utility? FlyingKick losing agility scaling? Alacrity? Increase heals or Wisdom scaling?
If this thread is where we are talking about it, lets get start with a clear idea of what classes are being left alone so we can focus on which classes need work.

IMO, what if plaguebomb came back with a bit less damage (slightly less, like from 250-->225 for perspective), but the sheep had safefall, so it was harder land and would require more risk, promoting the use of CC more. to compensate, maybe change pulse to a copy of melodicbindings, but rename it to arcanedust or something (with pink particles) for the more CC effect kind of thing. purge could detonate the sheep.

runeblade's resource management isnt really that hard 1v1, but otherwise you run OOM after the first person in a teamfight is dead. in addition to running OOM after the target's dead, you're prolly at or below half HP due to low armor and mid HP. 1v1's it excells however, able to run from any other threats in the area after eliminating the target (especislaly wizards like it's meant to )

disciple's force moves need their damage back. what if, instead of a forcepull, a projectile was released (bonespear copy, slower speed) that had a pullback, instead of a knockback, and would add more versatility to the class in group fights when you pull a group of people to you. obviously damage wouldn't be as high as necro, and would be about the same as forcepull should be, but it scales from int and has a 15 block range. (idea from scorpion from mortal combat, or pudge from dota 2)

Druids Kiting is too strong, PLaying druid is way to easy atm, any decent druid can beat most classes 1v1 (unless it is silenced whole time or bursted down all the way)

reduce ire from 160 at 30 int to 125~ with 30 int and increase bolt damage by about 25~ nerfs damage slightly. OOR add a .5-1.25 second warmup on ire as it IS a healer, not a mage.

a bit of my input on discussed items.

 

[Dsawemd]

IMO, what if plaguebomb came back with a bit less damage (slightly less, like from 250-->225 for perspective), but the sheep had safefall, so it was harder land and would require more risk, promoting the use of CC more. to compensate, maybe change pulse to a copy of melodicbindings, but rename it to arcanedust or something (with pink particles) for the more CC effect kind of thing. purge could detonate the sheep.

runeblade

disciple's force moves need their damage back. what if, instead of a forcepull, a projectile was released (bonespear copy, slower speed) that had a pullback, instead of a knockback, and would add more versatility to the class in group fights when you pull a group of people to you. obviously damage wouldn't be as high as necro, and would be about the same as forcepull should be, but it scales from int and has a 15 block range. (idea from scorpion from mortal combat, or pudge from dota 2)


reduce ire from 160 at 30 int to 125~ with 30 int and increase bolt damage by about 25~ nerfs damage slightly. OOR add a .5-1.25 second warmup on ire as it IS a healer, not a mage.

Beguiler: Yes, much of the balance suggestions around this class center on making PlagueBomb take more CC to land and lowering PB damage. But what I am not sure about yet is if PlagueBomb is going to be able to come back on the server.
A MelodicBindings skill would be in the same vein as MassPiggify, and would be a nice replacement for their Max lvl skill (currently Entangle replaces both Piggify and MassPiggify).
We need to know 1. What skills the class will have available to it 2. If we are indeed going to change to direction of beguiler to a more control oriented class.

runeblade - k thanks

disicple: Adding skill shots would be nice, but too many BoneSpear-like abilities would cause lag for disciples.

Druid: I like the idea of keeping druid offensive damage up while reducing kiting. I think a .5 sec warmup on Ire would accomplish that.

 

[Kainzo]

Prepping to start making changes - tomorrow I will be focusing on getting changes under way and on test server for all to test.

 

[mikehk]

disicple: Adding skill shots would be nice, but too many BoneSpear-like abilities would cause lag for disciples.

or instead maybe a snowball or low velocity arrow, like grapplinghook, but it doesnt pull you if it misses, also instant cast.

 

[LightningCape]

Here's a list of changes that doesn't require completely new skills or coding. This also includes skills that change in function using code that already exists which are marked with ***
@Kainzo
Ranger-

• Reduce base armor number from 42.5 to 30
• Add a regent of 1-2 gunpowder to Explosiveshot
• Aimedshot (several options) ***
  • Fix the fact you can shoot arrows while charging this
  • Make it so the arrow will miss if they're not looking at the target (think I've seen line of sight on other skills so nothing new)

Bard-

• Lower base HP from 675 to 630
• Lower bow dmg
  • Numbers for this seem unavaible but fully charged arrows on a max bard do over 110 dmg easily (no agility points)
• Reduce disk dmg from 56.7 to 50

Runeblade-

• Nothing

Ninja- (le sigh)

• Remove free shuriken on backflip
• remove Garrote
• Possibly "test" new smoke idea (no new coding really required) ***
  • Fade is now a toggle skill. When toggled it make the user invisible. This would allow ninja to constantly go in and out of visability providing a new dynamic to the class.
    • Mana: 25 mana per second.
    • Stamina: 65 Stamina per second ( With this, a ninja wouldn't be able to stealth and regain his stamina mid battle)
    • Cooldown: 5 seconds after you've become visible. You become visible when ever you: Take damage, deal damage, or use any skill (This includes fade which will simply reveal you.)

Pyromancer-

• Nothing

Wizard- (finally)

• Lower fireball damage (initial) from 95 to 70
• Lower blink initial range from 8 to 5 and keep scaling at 0.1 per INT
• Remove range scaling on Arcaneblast and reduce range to 6 blocks (from 12+scaling)
• Reduce dmg on Arcaneblast from 215 to 180
• Reduce warm up on arcaneblast from 6-5 to 4
• Increase entangle CD from 20 to 35

Necromancer-

• Fix speed of bonesear (slower)

Beguiler

• Reduce plaguebomb scaling from 2.875 to 1
• Add nausea effect on plaguebomb ***
  • Or better yet the beguile effect but nausea if nothing

Dreadknight-

• Re-add shadowstep

Paladin-

• None

berserker-

• Change Rupture bleeding from 5 damage every block to 10 damage every block (still 8 secs)

Dragoon- (le sigh)

• Jump (le sigh)
  • Decrease CD from 7.5 to 6
  • Increase stam cost from 400 to (550-650)
  • Yes this nerfs running, deal with it.
• Reduce left click base damage on all spades by 6

Druid-

• None

Cleric-

• None

Disciple-

• @TrueCorruptor lol

Shaman-

• @0xNaomi ideas?
• Possibly reduce firestrike totem damage
  • Does pretty high dmg with no attributes

Bloodmage-

• Fix stealessence
  • Currently steals nothing
• Fix boilblood ***
  • DoT only hits 1 person when it should hit more (initial dmg does hit more than 1 target)