Zeal Plots and Their Current Problem

[Thejoker1177]

I know that people constantly are saying we are not a pvp server etc. Saying that we are a hardcore server with the heroes plugin is basically saying we are a hardcore server with heavily modified pvp. Why? Because there are 16 pvp classes to choose from compared to four building/money making classes. This shows how our server should be leaning towards the pvp side but still allow for decent crafter gameplay.

Also, about walking out further. When you walk out further, most people are sheltered in towns. In addition, the concentration of players at Zeal is by fair denser than anywhere on the map because players are spawning there all the time. The only problem is that people only have to grab redstone from a shop in zeal and avoid any danger from campers and bandits. If chest shops are not allowed, people would have to walk out to shops to grab their redstone.

I joined the server about a month ago and started playing again a couple days ago. I have never been on where bandits and raiders camp at the shops. This seems very fun and much more challenging than every shop looking like a ghost town. I wouldn't go too extreme to ban shops in zeal, i would try to think of a smaller change.

 

[GraRona]

I joined the server about a month ago and started playing again a couple days ago. I have never been on where bandits and raiders camp at the shops. This seems very fun and much more challenging than every shop looking like a ghost town. I wouldn't go too extreme to ban shops in zeal, i would try to think of a smaller change.[/quote

Before you joined the server, people would camp Airbus101's shop, a shop at the edge of the zeal border on the west road. I agree, it was painful to go shopping there, but it was hella fun. Many times there would be brawls there with 20+ people setting spawns and duking it out.

I can't seem to find a solution to the lack of pvp near Zeal while still allowing shops in Zeal. If anyone has any ideas, please post here.

 

[agentjwall]

Granola, you need to keep in mind that the "airbus raids" (as I fondly refer to them as) stopped happening because most of the TCs got banned for various reasons. Also PvP is Initiated by players so If you feel you need some PvP go start a war or raid a town. The more you do that, the more PvP will be created as a result...

 

[GraRona]

The server's pvp side shouldn't be based around camping shops that are in pvp zones. Its very VERY aggravating to go to a shop with gold to sell and in the process of trying you get jumped and lose it all. So having zeal plots with chest shops does not lessen pvp, it simply forces the pvp to be more well rounded and less focused on one aspect that almost always leads to dispute and in some cases, banishment. Also people don't spend time in random zeal shops, they spend more time in their town or donor region which is the main cause for the decrease in pvp. Rails shouldn't become a pvp zone, seeing as you could easily camp it, and take advantage of players being stuck in a minecart... The rails are mainly meant for traveling long distance, like around 1000 blocks or more. I use the tracks to get to Zeal from Atlantis, because its a 2k block travel, and would take too long on foot.

Atlantis to Zeal actually doesn't take too long on foot. There is a paved road meaning I can sprint continuously. It takes me around ~7 minutes to get to Zeal from Atlantis/Shattergate. Also, Zeal plots are most definitely the problem of pvp. Before Zeal plots, there were township regions but there still was a whole lot of pvp around Zeal. If the server doesn't want to have pvp centralized around shops that are in no pvp zones, then do something about township regions. Zeal pvp is the best because

1. The highest concentration of players are at Zeal.
2. Going elsewhere to fight is not worth it. You have to walk or take the railroad far out into the map. Once there you have two choices. 1. Fight the people assuming you will win the fight. 2. Set a spawn via bed assuming you will die at least once. MOST likely you will have one member in your group die once. This means that they will be teleported allllll the way back to their spawn. If they choose to fight again, they will have to walk/ride all the way back. If you were anticipating and set a spawn, you will respawn with 0 items.
3. Raiding towns are not worth it. You can't steal anything because everything is covered. Most of the time, you will not grab too many kills on a regioned town. If you are more skillful or have more numbers then the town you are raiding, they will most likely cower in the townhall.
4. Like Stealth said, you can grab those delicious kills that come with gold when people are running to shops to sell their gold. Stealth, I bet if you were the person who killed the infuriated person who died with gold, you wouldn't be infuriated nor would you give it back. Would you? Also, people would have to make smarter decisions by selling their gold to non-chestshops and to players instead. This drastically lowers the chance of you dying while carrying gold.

Zeal plots are not forcing pvp to be more rounded in anyway. They are only taking away from the best type of pvp on this server.

 

[GraRona]

Granola, you need to keep in mind that the "airbus raids" (as I fondly refer to them as) stopped happening because most of the TCs got banned for various reasons. Also PvP is Initiated by players so If you feel you need some PvP go start a war or raid a town. The more you do that, the more PvP will be created as a result...

The TCs got banned right when Zeal plots were introduced. Also, see my previous points on why it is not worth it to start a raid on a town. The only towns worth raiding are the ones from the Adrastos kingdom because they are brave enough to not wall off their town.

 

[victim130]

I know that people constantly are saying we are not a pvp server etc. Saying that we are a hardcore server with the heroes plugin is basically saying we are a hardcore server with heavily modified pvp. Why? Because there are 16 pvp classes to choose from compared to four building/money making classes. This shows how our server should be leaning towards the pvp side but still allow for decent crafter gameplay.

Also, about walking out further. When you walk out further, most people are sheltered in towns. In addition, the concentration of players at Zeal is by fair denser than anywhere on the map because players are spawning there all the time. The only problem is that people only have to grab redstone from a shop in zeal and avoid any danger from campers and bandits. If chest shops are not allowed, people would have to walk out to shops to grab their redstone.

I kill many people, both walking from and to Zeal, you are making an argument off your ignorance. I am simply trying to tell you that you are making a conflict based on your opinion, not facts. I say learn all aspects before bring up such suggestions.

And if it is greed that fuels this, I would like to say that, with patience good things will come. Don't look for fifty men, look for one.

 

[Kalkyte]

C'mon guys. Please just make your point. There's no need to bash others for making theirs.

 

[_AMPLiFY]

Hey, I couldnt agree more with this. I made a thread focusing on not seeing people around in general, tell me what you think. It sort of relates to this in a way.

http://herocraftonline.com/forum/index.php?threads/a-map-idea.10351/

 

[GraRona]

I kill many people, both walking from and to Zeal, you are making an argument off your ignorance. I am simply trying to tell you that you are making a conflict based on your opinion, not facts. I say learn all aspects before bring up such suggestions.

And if it is greed that fuels this, I would like to say that, with patience good things will come. Don't look for fifty men, look for one.

Sorry. I simply don't have the patience to wait hours on end for a few people. You may kill many, but the point I am trying to make here is that Zeal plots have REDUCED the amount of people on roads. They have not COMPLETELY demolished travelling on roads.

Also, there is completely no need (Like good ol' Kal said) to bash me of my ignorance etc. Just please state why my suggestion is not right instead of insulting me for making a bad suggestion. I am trying to be considerate here. I could've said to abolish Zeal plots completely, but of course no one would like that.

 

[KrunknMunky]

when the HTTP system comes out, there should be a war system integrated with that, which would bring a lot more pvp! /quote]

did you read anything i said?

 

[GraRona]

Simply countering and addressing other's claims.

 

[Diffuse]

90% of the pvp I get these days is from protecting random towns that are being raided. If anyone wants some pvp you should come duel me at the cage or arena. Nobody ever wants to fight me 1v1 for some reason

As far as zeal plots go, I do agree that they have caused a reduction in pvp around the map, but removing shops or other things from them doesn't seem to be the best way about dealing with it. People like airbus have invested heavily into getting a plot used exclusively for having a shop. Zeal plots have reduced shop pvp, but without the TCs that was very limited anyway.

The biggest problem I see is that you can no longer catch travelers going to their town from zeal because of the rail system, but once again I don't see a good solution to this either.

The changing or removal of these systems would probably cause more overall harm than good. The only thing that I think would bring pvp back are formal arena pvp events (that 20 people FFA hardly counts as pvp imo, just a bunch of idiots swinging at whatever is in front of em), a war system, or towns being forced to be open to enemies.

 

[Kainzo]

We will be making some changes on 1.0 to PVP regions. The spawn area will be safe - but the zeal plots may not have PVP protection

 

[Diffuse]

Brb, setting mark inside AoA base.

 

[Dazureus]

That's intriguing... No-pvp is part of the appeal of having a Zeal plot, isn't it?

I would be alright with outlawing shops on plots if we could open shops at the bazaar.

 

[MoeJunur]

well why not just take all protections off and let the fighters have it!
the thing of pvp'ing is not to camp an area it is to search for victums, i think the pvp'ers are just to lazy to look and want the victums to come to them.
I'll not be one of them!!
Later

 

[Kainzo]

Outlawing - takes too much effort - letting the players police themselves = better.

Our goal here is to allow players to do what they want, but have an invisible hand guide them to what might be best.

IE, pvp protected shops in Zeal vs Plots - sure you can have a shop - but its unlikely you'll go unless its just clearly awesome.

 

[victim130]

We will be making some changes on 1.0 to PVP regions. The spawn area will be safe - but the zeal plots may not have PVP protection

One problem with this is the obvious changes that will occur. One being other arenas and stuff that would just make Zeal look bad.

And sorry Granola, I didn't mean to sound as if bashing, I was simply stating that you are coming out of ignorance here. Take into the fact we are not upgraded yet either and that wanted full out PvP between many people, will never happen unless well planned out with or without Zeal Shops/plots. I'm only trying to say that the change will be so minimal, that there is hardly a reason to change it and I think one or two more men on the road will not make a big change at that.

As for AoA's event (Kill-A-Thon) I was able to kill a total of 28+27 in my group of two. That was over the course of maybe 3 hours of total play time (Minus the time I spent doing nothing while being online) Zeal is to be a safe haven, not a camping place. Look for PvP hot zones, raid towns, hunt stray players etc. I do it all and I do just fine with my kills and get in a nice bit of PvP and some challenge too with the return of Rane/TC. In the event, I may have got a few North Road kills (15-20 out of both of us combined) then most others were raiding the town of Indica. A few stray kills here and there with Hanpeter and others. I saw almost non-stop combat that day only because I looked for it instead of waiting for it (Which camping entails) I guess what I'm getting at is, Zeal shops/plots are only hurting the lazy PvPers instead of the real ones. (Again, I mean no offense by this, simply speaking my mind on the matter)

 

[c12095]

We will be making some changes on 1.0 to PVP regions. The spawn area will be safe - but the zeal plots may not have PVP protection

This 100%

 

[GreekCrackShot]

So what about the main roads leading to the outskirts of Zeal? Will those be PvP on? I don't think that's a good idea tbh, camping will be too common and unfair to the newer players.