Unfair damage system?

[Texteo]

Okay if we all remember how it was said
Warrior - Medium damage / high hp - tanker
rogue - medium hp /high dmg - Dps
Healer- medium hp / low dmg- support
caster- low hp /high dmg(spells), low phis. dmg - dps

Okay now we all know how much damage each class does at best weapon.
Now this is kinda unfair. Disciple who uses a stick of a fish to deal 6 damage. now this fascinates me because paladins who are supposed to do medium damage they do 5 hp damage with the diamond (gold breaks too fast and eitherway its 6hp) so how does this make a healer class do low dmg? They also have a forcepush ,forcepull and ironfist which throw you in the air and deal 5 heart of damage WHEN wearing full set armor. Now this makes me laugh because the caster class who deals low phisical damage is ALSO 5 HP. Which would mean that paladin and dreadknight do low dmg instead of medium. Even having armor it doesn't help much because when 2+ people attack you and believe me they will you are screwed. Now dreadknights actually have a survival skill called drainsoul but paladins don't have anything. Soulfire activates after 10+ hits and if its raining like it mostly is its useless. Paladins should get a bit higher hp. Paladins got nerfed over and over and now its kinda useless unless you wish to stall for time. You can kill a person in 1v1 fight but only because of layhands and thats 1 person. So paladins should atleast do 7 hp dmg with a diamond sword.
@Kainzo

 

[Diavolo1988]

hmm, perhaps there should be like 3 levels of damage areas, (like low (4-6) medium (7-10) and high (11-15)) would fix this issue? Then giving the different classes damage/health abilities as you described in your op, texteo. So healers and casters would deal 4-6 melee, warriors 7-10 and rogues 11-15.

 

[iHazBryn]

With the buff to armor in 3.0 Paladins will be actually be able to use their armor.

Dragoons do 7 hp with a diamond spade dont they? It seems pretty balanced to me. You just have to remember that your not meant to be a damage dealer, your meant to be a tank.

 

[Texteo]

With the buff to armor in 3.0 Paladins will be actually be able to use their armor.

Dragoons do 7 hp with a diamond spade dont they? It seems pretty balanced to me. You just have to remember that your not meant to be a damage dealer, your meant to be a tank.

Didnt you read ? I said paladins and dreadknights. They should also do medium damage but they do 5 damage like caster which means its low instead of medium . But dreadknights actually can survive because they dont even need to attack due to some skills (hint lvl 50). But paladins can't fight away anything. They are supposed to be tank and this doesnt make their damage any better than rogues (as it shouldn't) but if you look at it wouldn't medium damage be half the highest ? Basicly 7 not 5.

 

[Texteo]

hmm, perhaps there should be like 3 levels of damage areas, (like low (4-6) medium (7-10) and high (11-15)) would fix this issue? Then giving the different classes damage/health abilities as you described in your op, texteo. So healers and casters would deal 4-6 melee, warriors 7-10 and rogues 11-15.

But there are 3 levels of damage sistem xD if you remember when kainzo implemented the hp and dmg mod he said on herocraft main page how it goes. But yea thats what I'm trying to say tho

 

[Danda]

Didnt you read ? I said paladins and dreadknights. They should also do medium damage but they do 5 damage like caster which means its low instead of medium . But dreadknights actually can survive because they dont even need to attack due to some skills (hint lvl 50). But paladins can't fight away anything. They are supposed to be tank and this doesnt make their damage any better than rogues (as it shouldn't) but if you look at it wouldn't medium damage be half the highest ? Basicly 7 not 5.

• Paladins Sacrifice Damage for increased HP and Armor when they go to warrior.
• Dreadknights have High damage abilities. (They have the highest damage single target nuke of any class)
• Dragoons Do not have the HP of a Dread Knight or Paladin and thus are given more damage.
• Samurai are High damage at the cost of HP and thus have lower HP than some Healer and Rogue specs.

It is balanced the way it is. By increasing the damage of Paladin and Dread knight's weapons you are making dragoons worthless as you could be able to get more tank and more damage from either a Dread Knight or a Paladin.

You are also complaining about a Healer doing the same damage. But are overlooking the fact you have more HP and better armor thus can out tank them and win the fight. You also are not taking into account the damage from soul fire and other abilities like that you have.

There is more to class balance than how much damage each class does in melee combat.

Also by your definition of each of the classes Samurai should get their damage nerfed and their HP buffed.

 

[Texteo]

You are also complaining about a Healer doing the same damage. But are overlooking the fact you have more HP and better armor thus can out tank them and win the fight. You also are not taking into account the damage from soul fire and other abilities like that you have.

There is more to class balance than how much damage each class does in melee combat.

Also by your definition of each of the classes Samurai should get their damage nerfed and their HP buffed.

Well Im not talking to the healer class as it is, but to a certain path in the healer class (disciple). The thing is they can throw you in the air 10+ blocks and even with armor you would survive with 3 hearts (paladin and dreadknights) meaning other classes can't compare to that. But thats another story. I wish they keep the skills on that class but its kinda unfair when you think about it. Punching someone with a fist and a sword isn't the same thing. So basicly disciples with no weapons (stick or fish) will do more damage than a sword?

Think about it and also I only wanted to say how paladins do 5 hp damage same as a caster <----- ffs man healer and a caster compares with a paladin in close combat -.-'' . Even by having more health it only increases 2-3 more possible hits from a rogue class to survive. How is that fair?

Edit: Also your probably gonna comment how paladins have heal. Bullshit!!!! Dreadknight who is a supposedly a combination of a caster and tank (magic dps) has a better healing system. Paladins have 1 healing spell (apart from layhands which can be used every 15 min)
when healers have 5 spells including pray in that one....

It is balanced the way it is. By increasing the damage of Paladin and Dread knight's weapons you are making dragoons worthless as you could be able to get more tank and more damage from either a Dread Knight or a Paladin.

.

Lol even if paladins deal same damage as dragoon its not making them worthless -.- . Dragoons have fast manouvering skills and can get in and out of combat easy + they are the only class for now that I know which can kill a disciple with ease.

 

[jwplayer0]

Well Im not talking to the healer class as it is, but to a certain path in the healer class (disciple). The thing is they can throw you in the air 10+ blocks and even with armor you would survive with 3 hearts (paladin and dreadknights) meaning other classes can't compare to that. But thats another story. I wish they keep the skills on that class but its kinda unfair when you think about it. Punching someone with a fist and a sword isn't the same thing. So basicly disciples with no weapons (stick or fish) will do more damage than a sword?

Think about it and also I only wanted to say how paladins do 5 hp damage same as a caster <----- ffs man healer and a caster compares with a paladin in close combat -.-'' . Even by having more health it only increases 2-3 more possible hits from a rogue class to survive. How is that fair?

Edit: Also your probably gonna comment how paladins have heal. Bullshit!!!! Dreadknight who is a supposedly a combination of a caster and tank (magic dps) has a better healing system. Paladins have 1 healing spell (apart from layhands which can be used every 15 min)
when healers have 5 spells including pray in that one....

Deciple (or monk as i will still say) is the melee damage dealer of the healing class, the only healer which is meant to have the stats of a healer is the druid, most of the other ones have diffrent roles

 

[Texteo]

Deciple (or monk as i will still say) is the melee damage dealer of the healing class, the only healer which is meant to have the stats of a healer is the druid, most of the other ones have diffrent roles

I know but if you've read what I wrote you would see that paladins are supposed to do medium damage but are on the low damage stat :/

 

[Danda]

Well Im not talking to the healer class as it is, but to a certain path in the healer class (disciple). The thing is they can throw you in the air 10+ blocks and even with armor you would survive with 3 hearts (paladin and dreadknights) meaning other classes can't compare to that.

Yes but their force pull/push/etc skills can be very unreliable and are heavilly lag dependant. As a Dragoon I know this our Jump and their push pull skills work on the same mechanic. On a side note None of those skills are capable of throwing you that high in the air unless you are stood on a tall object or are next to a cliff either way that is them using their skill to their advantage. You are putting yourself in a position where they can do that to you.

On a side note Fall damage is % HP based not exact damage which means that all other classes would survive with about the same HP

Punching someone with a fist and a sword isn't the same thing. So basicly disciples with no weapons (stick or fish) will do more damage than a sword?

Yes they can do high damage with one skill. But can you also not make youself completely immune to damage for a short period?
Can you also heal yourself more efficiently than he can?
Do you have more HP than he does?
Do you have more damage reduction than he does?

Taking all these things into account you are doing more melee damage than he is.

Think about it and also I only wanted to say how paladins do 5 hp damage same as a caster <----- ffs man healer and a caster compares with a paladin in close combat -.-'' . Even by having more health it only increases 2-3 more possible hits from a rogue class to survive.

Can a Rogue class heal?
Can a Rogue class make itself immune to damage?
Can you significantly lower the damage a Rogue class is doing to you in melee combat with armor?

You are looking at this too narrowly when looking at this balance you need to take skills into account as well.

I know but if you've read what I wrote you would see that paladins are supposed to do medium damage but are on the low damage stat :/

Incorrect It says that Warriors are medium damage high HP not paladins. Samurai do not follow so what makes you keep thinking that this applies to paladins as well.

 

[jwplayer0]

I know but if you've read what I wrote you would see that paladins are supposed to do medium damage but are on the low damage stat :/

For the most part classes should be judged by their role not their path. Paladins are tanks and shouldnt be doing much damage where as monks are meant to do damage and have low healing capabilities.

 

[Danda]

For the most part classes should be judged by their role not their path. Paladins are tanks and shouldnt be doing much damage where as monks are meant to do damage and have low healing capabilities.

That is one point I was trying to get across but I didn't really word it well

 

[EvilThor]

You complain over that you loose when you are 1v2
If you get two person attacking you whit a wepound you are kind of dead, not strange at all.
Paladins are not supposed to do damage they is supposed to take the damage instead of they who can do harm, that is why Pallys can't do much damage while other warriors can.

 

[Texteo]

Yes but their force pull/push/etc skills can be very unreliable and are heavilly lag dependant. As a Dragoon I know this our Jump and their push pull skills work on the same mechanic. On a side note None of those skills are capable of throwing you that high in the air unless you are stood on a tall object or are next to a cliff either way that is them using their skill to their advantage. You are putting yourself in a position where they can do that to you.

On a side note Fall damage is % HP based not exact damage which means that all other classes would survive with about the same HP
.

xD Trust me you can be thrown that high xD and I wasn't in a high in fact it was a flat desert land . Only Iron fist can't throw you. It pushes you 3 blocks high at most what I noticed and 10 blocks away. And I'm not sure about the % of fall dmg because I died as a dragoon no armor from 1 of that skill. Megan just tossed me like 15 blocks in air and I didnt have anything binded on keyboard so I couldn't jump.

Yes they can do high damage with one skill. But can you also not make youself completely immune to damage for a short period?
Can you also heal yourself more efficiently than he can?
Do you have more HP than he does?
Do you have more damage reduction than he does?

First of all thats 5 seconds long. Its not helpfull much and you can cast it every 5 -7 min
I cant heal myself more efficiently than he can
I have more hp which is useless against his forcepull / forcepush as I stated
Thanks to dmg reduction I barely survive those 2 skills

Can a Rogue class heal?
Can a Rogue class make itself immune to damage?
Can you significantly lower the damage a Rogue class is doing to you in melee combat with armor?

You are looking at this too narrowly when looking at this balance you need to take skills into account as well.

Lol I dont have anything against rogues and don't wish to discuss them because they seems balanced (atleast for me) except some classes should get a bit better armor.

Incorrect It says that Warriors are medium damage high HP not paladins. Samurai do not follow so what makes you keep thinking that this applies to paladins as well.

It says warrior and is stated its paths aswell to have medium damage (and seriously 2 hp more really bugs you?)

 

[Diffuse]

Most of the specs change their roles into hybrids. Paladins become a mix of healer and warrior with increased healing and health, but less damage. Disciples are a rogue/healer mix so they have higher damage than normal. Those things about warrior being high hp medium damage are more like guidelines for the bases and specs are more mixes of those bases.

Separate issue but if disciples are the same as monks they can do a good 8 or so hearts just from pushing and pulling and abusing the fall damage.

 

[Texteo]

For the most part classes should be judged by their role not their path. Paladins are tanks and shouldnt be doing much damage where as monks are meant to do damage and have low healing capabilities.

Yes thats what Im saying. Classes should do by their roles but Paladin isn't only a tanker but a dps (though kainzo placed him as a tanker on server). Normaly paladin has stuns, magic that hurts undead and/or other races. He also has fair damage aswell . But I'm only saying that his phisical strength shouldn't be compared to a caster :/

 

[Texteo]

You complain over that you loose when you are 1v2
If you get two person attacking you whit a wepound you are kind of dead, not strange at all.
Paladins are not supposed to do damage they is supposed to take the damage instead of they who can do harm, that is why Pallys can't do much damage while other warriors can.

You are an idiot. Learn english and then actually READ the true reason beyond this topic. I'm not saying paladins should be able to win 2v1 or 5v1 I'm saying their damage is same as a caster which it shouldn't be. They are phisicaly beyond better than a caster (or even a healer )

 

[Papabear20xd6]

I agree with everyones rebuttal. The descriptions for classes can't and shouldn't be used as strict guide lines. It wouldn't be any fun at all if all the sub classes did the exact same damage. The whole point of making them unique is people will have different preferences on who they choose. I feel like in most cases when a class is lacking in something it is made up for in something else. Just like what everyone has been saying paladins can heal, (a full self heal and pray) they get revive (which is bullshit because not even all the healer classes get) they get invuln, and they can set people on fire. Not to mention the highest HP in game and the best armor possible. Honestly I think paladins are overpowered still and still need some tweaking. Uping there damage would be adding insult to injury.

 

[Texteo]

Most of the specs change their roles into hybrids. Paladins become a mix of healer and warrior with increased healing and health, but less damage. Disciples are a rogue/healer mix so they have higher damage than normal. Those things about warrior being high hp medium damage are more like guidelines for the bases and specs are more mixes of those bases.

Separate issue but if disciples are the same as monks they can do a good 8 or so hearts just from pushing and pulling and abusing the fall damage.

Actually paladins (if you played any game at all ) aren't a mix of healer and warrior but actually caster and warrior. They have many spells that can burn, stun, aswell heal and revive, shock,....

 

[Papabear20xd6]

Sorry Text but in most of the games I have played paladin is more of a healer warrior then a caster warrior. I understand the point of doing the same melee damage as a caster is a bit off. But considering everything else you bring to the table, the damage sorta falls short.