Suggestion Touchin that Harm - Harmtouch

[BlackOhso]

Ok well I don't know if this is a rant or a suggestion or whatever the hell it is so move it where it needs to be. But I am curious as to why Harmtouch, keep in mind it does an average of 230-250 based on attributes, and Bolt for Wizards does about the same damage more or less. If we look at harmtouch cool down, it is 15 minutes, Bolt cool down is 30 seconds. I understand that Wizards are more squishy and than dread knights but a 30 second CD compared to a 15 MINUTE CD is redonkydonk. They both do the same amount of damage. And lets not even mention these slutty rangers with AimShot that does 240-260 damage, 15 SECOND CD, half the dam time of bolt, same damage.

What I'm just trying to say is that all those whore skills do about the same damage as harm touch, but their cool downs are 30 seconds or less, but then we have big boy dk harm touch that has a 15 minute cd. Makes sense? I think not!

So if this is a suggestion, then i am suggesting the cool down of harm touch be reduced to maybe a minute or two like geez.

If the cd is related to lore then wth... why

 

[Jack_Reacher]

You can't compare apples and oranges, man. It's not sufficient to just look at one skill from each class - only examining its cooldown and damage - without assessing the classes as a whole! Dreadknight shouldn't have a Bolt like Wizards or Aimedshot like Rangers! Look at the classes holistically! Using your argument style - I could say "Wizard doesn't have heals like Cleric! Give me heals!" or "Wizard only has one CC skill but Beguiler has three! Give Wizards more CC!". It just doesn't make sense.

Present a more complete argument if you want to be taken seriously.

To be fair, you said you didn't know if you were just ranting or not - so I'll tell you. You're just ranting.

 

[BlackOhso]

Dreadknights have 4 useful skills, dread aura isn't shit. Soulleech, Decay, Empathy, Harmtouch, Once HT is on cd, 1/4 of your damage is unavailable for 15minutes. You are only at your max potential once every 15 minutes, the rest of the time you become not as useful compared to other classes that have their constant damage within seconds.

 

[Variently]

You can't compare apples and oranges, man. It's not sufficient to just look at one skill from each class - only examining its cooldown and damage - without assessing the classes as a whole! Dreadknight shouldn't have a Bolt like Wizards or Aimedshot like Rangers! Look at the classes holistically! Using your argument style - I could say "Wizard doesn't have heals like Cleric! Give me heals!" or "Wizard only has one CC skill but Beguiler has three! Give Wizards more CC!". It just doesn't make sense.

Present a more complete argument if you want to be taken seriously.

To be fair, you said you didn't know if you were just ranting or not - so I'll tell you. You're just ranting.

DK also has one effective CC. And most spells are within 4 blocks. Soulleech is the best range skill but it slows us down when using. DK is supposed to be a melee/caster class, yet i don't even have the chance to get close enough to cast spells most of the time. Wizard CC is at level 20. Yet DK is unlocked till master level?

 

[Jack_Reacher]

Wizard CC is at level 20. Yet DK is unlocked till master level?

Just master your class. I'm sick of people complaining about the balance of unmastered classes.

 

[Variently]

Dreadknights have 4 useful skills, dread aura isn't shit. Soulleech, Decay, Empathy, Harmtouch, Once HT is on cd, 1/4 of your damage is unavailable for 15minutes. You are only at your max potential once every 15 minutes, the rest of the time you become not as useful compared to other classes that have their constant damage within seconds.

Keep in mind that soulleech was a warm up. 1 sec. So this skill is useless when chasing people. Empathy is good only when our health is at a low point, for it to hit its full potential.

 

[Jack_Reacher]

And there is precedent for 15 minute cooldowns. Look at Layhands. Why is this on such a long CD? Because it's a heal "nuke". The same goes for Harmtouch.

 

[Variently]

Just master your class. I'm sick of people complaining about the balance of unmastered classes.

I'm 1 level away from master. Not everybody will be master. You have to view it from that point of view, not from a masters point of view...

 

[BlackOhso]

And there is precedent for 15 minute cooldowns. Look at Layhands. Why is this on such a long CD? Because it's a heal "nuke". The same goes for Harmtouch.

ok you just said its a nuke if we look at it damage wise, thats what I'm saying, wizards have nukes and so do rangers, i don't see a 15 minute cool down for them either?

 

[Variently]

And there is precedent for 15 minute cooldowns. Look at Layhands. Why is this on such a long CD? Because it's a heal "nuke". The same goes for Harmtouch.

Don't compare HarmTouch to Layhands. I've mastered Paladin before. And layhands puts you back at a peak, With health. HarmTouch does a good amount of damage. And it removes health.

 

[Jack_Reacher]

I'm just saying there's a precedent for 15min cooldowns.

ok you just said its a nuke if we look at it damage wise, thats what I'm saying, wizards have nukes and so do rangers, i don't see a 15 minute cool down for them either?

You clearly don't understand what I'm saying. You can't just say "another class has a nuke, that works like BLAHBLAHBLAH with X damage and X cooldown so I should too". Look at the class as a whole and make an argument as to why Dreadknight actually needs a nuke with a lower CD.

 

[BlackOhso]

Im seeking an explanation as to why it is 15 minute cool down, and everything else isn't, can you explain that?

 

[Jack_Reacher]

I cannot, as I don't know what the exact thinking was behind choosing 15min. But I can see the general line of thought: a warrior class has a magic nuke, so it needs to have a big CD.

 

[Variently]

I'm just saying there's a precedent for 15min cooldowns.

You clearly don't understand what I'm saying. You can't just say "another class has a nuke, that works like BLAHBLAHBLAH with X damage and X cooldown so I should too". Look at the class as a whole and make an argument as to why Dreadknight actually needs a nuke with a lower CD.

Want a reason why it needs a change? Because i'm playing this class. And most DK i know, confirm that most range classes have an advantage over us.

 

[macura]

Harmtouch is still on dk because of lore, for a while it was questioned whether it should even be a skill on dk. Why are you asking for a buff? The reason harmtouch has a large ass cooldown is because it is a straight up nuke being given to a high hp lifestealing tank. The point of dk isn't to nuke it is to sustain damage. That is why they work with dots, that is why they are tanky, that is why the steal health and that is why they can use curse, making them even more tanky. If any of these areas are lacking on dk then that is what should be fixed, not harmtouch. Wizards and rangers have nuke because they are none of the above and that is their purpose, to nuke, not dk.

Also @Variently casters are supposed to have an advantage over dk and i assume you are talking about casters because only casters and rangers have a majority ranged attacks. There might be a problem with ranger, idk but don't base an arguement over personal experience because you might not know how to play dk.

 

[STDs4YouAnd4Me]

My nose is bleeding because I facepalmed so hard after every comment BlackOhso made.

Dude... really?

 

[JupiterRome]

If it has the same cd as layhands I think its fine because @BlackOhso I would always accidentally use layhands (you know) and it would still be off cd (or close) for the next fight, I just wanna say that because it was being compared to layhands (it seemed like) but Idk much about dk balance accept I've fought a few dks and they did pretty well with harmtouch and empathy, (this was last map) they would just let me get them low (when I played wizard) then harmtouch + empathy...... i don't know if that's a great combo this map but it seemed to work out fine last map.

 

[teddytazer]

Keep in mind that soulleech was a warm up. 1 sec. So this skill is useless when chasing people. Empathy is good only when our health is at a low point, for it to hit its full potential.

As a past master dk/bloodmage, I can confirm soulleech has always been near useless in pvp. Once a play notices you casting it, they simply just backstep 4 blocks. and since the dk is slowed during this warmup, escape is really easy.

Regarding Harmtouch the cooldown has always been extreme due to the fact one-three dk's could all bind harmtouch to one players name and instantly destroy them with the push of the button, course did not they fix skills so you could no longer bind damage skills to people's names?
If this is true, I see no reason why harmtouch doesnt have a 1-5 min cooldown timer instead. and compared to Layhands.. which heals to full hp.. harmtouch is no where near that amount in damage.

 

[monkeyfatzer]

Dreadknights are tanky, and do a lot of magic damage, harmtouch doesn't need to be changed.

Edit: The reason wizards have the same thing but a 30 second cooldown is because they are really squishy and depend on their burst and mobility.

 

[Templar_James]

DKs are fine as is