Starting Up a Crafter's Guild. Interested?

[TheTXLibra]

I've decided to start up a Crafter's Guild. For those who care about credentials, I've played Minecraft since Indev, played on the last 3 or 4 maps of Herocraft, I am an Architect for DH Empire, and have build the spawn area of the last 2 maps. In the current map, I made the Bazaar (the thing that looks like the Hagia Sophia), in the center of Zeal.

This thread is for the brainstorming of how the guild would be run, what the bylaws would be, the price of membership (if any), the protections and benefits it affords, and so forth. My personal recommendation is to keep it absolutely as simple as possible, rules-wise, and that any bylaws/benefits/etc, be absolutely relevant to the point of having a guild.

My thoughts are that the Crafter's Guild would be something like a Union Shop, except that we actually work hard, and deliver quality work. Here are my thoughts so far on possible benefits/rules/etc.

Members of the Crafter's Guild:

• Will refuse service to anyone who has killed or robbed another member of the Crafter's Guild, unless some sort of reparation is paid both to the player attacked AND the Guild itself. This will discourage others from PVPing us or robbing us. If they know that killing or robbing us means we will never make them a lift, bridge, redstone circuit, repair their armor, etc, then I'd say that is a pretty strong deterrant. It only works though if every member abides by this rule 100%.
• Must charge Guild Rates for services. Guild Rates will be adjusted per the economy in small increments, or for large changes, will be voted on. Charging above or below Guild Rates would not be allowed. This is to ensure a reliable and comparable market for services rendered. There will be 3 levels of charge, apprentice, journeyman, and master, to reflect the difference in both quality and reputation of the craftsman. An apprentice would charge the least, journeyman 2nd highest, and master highest. Charging outside of your tier would be grounds for review and possible removal from the guild.
• Will always sign their work with their name AND that of the Crafter's Guild.
• Will be separated into three tiers: Apprentices, Journeymen, and Masters. Any CRAFTER who wants to join the Guild will be accepted once they are processed. They will then be an Apprentice until they prove themselves worthy of Journeyman. This isn't as hard as it sounds; we have many talented builders on the server who are not labeled as Architects by the staff. If you can (and do) build something impressive, Master Craftsmen will come out and inspect it. If it is good enough to merit it, you will be promoted to Journeyman. It must be something good, though. A box hut of wood/mud/cobble is not going to cut it. Master is only attainable through the Architect tag bestowed by HC Staff, OR by a unanimous vote by all other Guild Masters.
• Will have access to Guild Tips, Tricks, Web Page, etc, if such becomes available (which I believe it will).
• Will have access to the Guild Headquarters, once it is built, and the shared resources within.

More to follow if anyone shows interest. Reply if you are interested in joining, have suggestions, etc. Non-crafters need not apply or reply at this time. If you do reply, please state what your specialty is, if you've specialized, or what you plan on specializing in. Also your level, and whether or not you are an official server architect. Ideally, I would like to see all Server Architects who are Crafters to join this guild, so your input is especially important.

 

[MatTripp]

I was actually considering starting up something like this as a Union. Mainly so all (or most) of the crafters on this server will keep to 1 price for all mat's, that way all crafters will make a profit without dropping prices and undercutting each other to the point of no profit.

I would definitely be up for this libra, i think all the crafters on the server should consider this.

Although i would have to make a suggestion. All members of the guild would take Town afairs before the guild (if they are in a town) and leave all hatred/drama at the door when it comes to Guild buisness.

 

[Valalal]

Definitely very interested in this.

The by-laws sound good thus far. The only thing I can think of immediately would perhaps be the expansion of this into a Crafter's and Trader's Guild, as if all the major traders were also a part of this we could perhaps work out a system for in guild discounts on materials, and at the same time guarantee trader's supply. Just an idea though.

 

[TheTXLibra]

MatTripp, I agree that it's a good idea for Town affairs to be taken before Guild Affairs, so long as the Guild Prices are maintained, and City Business be left at the door as far as Guild Behavior is concerned. We don't want The Crafter's Guild to alienate Mayors, etc, by posing undue competition for their loyalty. But we do want a well-controlled market to avoid gluts and shortages.

Valalal, I think a Trader's Union is a great idea, though I think it should be separate from the Crafter's Guild, and membership need not be exclusive to either (you could be a member of both). The reason is because, while only Crafters can be a part of the Crafter's Guild, -anyone- should be capable of collecting stuff to sell (warriors might want to sell bones, mages may want to sell wood, or something... Plus I don't want the headache of running two separate guilds worth of services.

Can't wait to see how this all turns out.

 

[eisbaerBorealis]

Haha, I'm conservative and I hate the idea of real-life unions. But I'm willing to hear you out. I'm a level 29 Crafter, and will be specializing in Alchemy. I plan to have my "business" in the underwater glass dome next to the lava lighthouse, NW of Zeal. I planned on payments being 1x (x being either 1 gold ingot, 1 diamond, 2 slimeballs, 2 glowstone or 7 coins) per mixture. Then tacking on extra costs (1x, 2x, 3x, etc.) if they don't bring the ingredients themselves. I want to be able to take other rare items and not have my prices set by someone else. Also, how would you plan on having Alchemists "leveling up" from Apprentice to Master? All I do is right-click on some glass.

 

[TheTXLibra]

LOL, yeah, I'm not exactly fond of real life unions myself. There's nothing so makes a man entitled not to do a good job as there is a union job. But, that's why I'm referring to this as a Guild, which will be more about maintaining a semi-measurable level of quality and pricing and keeping the market from getting too insane, but also being able to supply people in need with people who have the ability to help (ie. Masons, Alchemists, Smiths, Engineers, Architectural Works, etc...) It seemed this demand was in increasingly large last map, with not nearly enough supply, or if supply existed, there was nothing to measure the worth or value against except the buyer's sheer desperation. Hopefully this time around we allay that problem.

 

[eisbaerBorealis]

Hmm... can we have a bit of leeway in the prices? Basically just different forms of currency. I will probably join if I can take my payment in the forms of gold, coins, glowstone, slimeballs, etc. The guild can tell me how many glowstone or slimeballs I need to charge.
But what happens if one alchemist doesn't join and brings the prices down? ...Maybe Alchemists just aren't made for this guild, because there is no "quality of work."

 

[MatTripp]

I would suggest that all payments should come out equal. Even if you want to use different forms of payment the value of those should come out to the same in coins. The thing that will make this a guild is if no one undercuts anyone else in anyway. If we can start this and it sticks there will always be a good economy on Hero Craft. It's when people start undercutting each other in some way or form thats when economy's become shit.

Also I work for a union in California and we are one of the best for the entertainment buisness, so please dont say union workers dont do good jobs, because without my union a lot of TV shows, Concerts, and award shows would not be as good as they are.

 

[TheTXLibra]

Absolutely, on both counts. Not only are Alchemists a great addition, but will be vital both as a source of rare materials and for strong guidelines as to what prices to charge for those rare materials, since they will have the best idea as to what it takes to make them. Plus, do not forget, Alchemists are a natural fit for Architects as well. An Alchemist might only spend as much time making materials as it takes to complete a project, or they might make it their prime passion and supply other Architects instead, or something in between. As for taking mats in lieu of payment, I think that's an excellent point. Many times, mats would have served me far better than coin. I think leeway as far as non-currency mats are concerned (ie. not gold), is certainly an option.

And for Crafters who don't join and sell/buy/service for prices far outside of Guild Range, it largely depends upon the success of the Guild. If The Guild is the most reliable, consistent form of pricing, we will largely be the status quo. If our price for a typical good or service is 100c worth of X, and a non-member comes along and offers it for 50c, then they will either find themselves rapidly out of stock (where some other enterprising person will sell it for closer to guild prices) or overbooked on work (in which case they will come to the Guild because we'll be available). If they do shoddy work to try and accommodate all-comers, then word of mouth will tell that the servicer in question sucks. If they tried to price themselves above guild prices, people would quickly point out that he was ripping people off because The Guild only charges 100c, whereas they are trying to charge 300c. This is what I see being the case for -most- circumstances. The sheer numbers of the Guild, as well as adherence to its bylaws, would act as a buffer for the market, preventing non-members from selling for too much above or below our priceline, and making non-guild prices unsustainable in the long run.

That said, there may be exceptions to every rule. Perhaps non-guild Crafter Z not just occasionally under/oversells The Guild, but actively works to undermine its pricing and foundation. Well, then the Masters will decide what to do with the person. Perhaps we try the carrot, perhaps we try the stick. There will be exceptions, of course, but I believe they will be largely few and far between. And if I'm wrong, if everyone always succeeds wildly in under/overselling the Guild, then that's a strong indicator that we should have already adjusted our prices, and should immediately do so, as obviously the market will change from time to time.

 

[MatTripp]

Love your post libra all very well made points and i was thinking exactly the same thing as you wrote above. I am definitely down for this and hope many others are as well. This could help bring a lot of the crafters on the server be there friend or foe to put a positive feature into the server.

 

[Kainzo]

This sounds bad ass @TheTXLibra - I'm glad to have you as a part of Herocraft

 

[TheTXLibra]

Thank you, Chief. I hope it goes well.

MatTripp, what it will also do is hopefully take non-artisans and encourage them to become decent ones (Apprentice to Journeyman), and take decent artisans and make them great ones (Journeymen to Masters). We can share tips, tricks, ideas, aesthetic combinations that one might not otherwise think of. I wish I could access this site from work, as I could do a lot more with it during daytime hours.

Since I've been asked about the Guild Hall, construction on it won't begin until regions are fixed, however, as for what it will look like, it will be an original design in the style of Diego Villasenor.

http://www.dva.com.mx/

Click on the link and check out his Projects section. His use of lighting, space, simple geometry, and vernacular materials is incredible. It'll be a real challenge to emulate his style in Minecraft, but definitely one worth attempting.

As for where it will be, I would like for it to be near a Herogate, as I expect our services will quite often be in demand on short notice. And we are not exactly made for long, dangerous treks over land. The threat of not being able to contract the services of a Guild Crafter may not deter every attacker.

 

[MatTripp]

Well im down to try anything, i will be around to help build the guild hall if you want it. Im really close to being done with my Boat oustide of Newerth so after its done i should be able to work on some other things. I cant wait to start on this for sure lol.

 

[eisbaerBorealis]

I've gotten really settled down in my glass dome/lighthouse, so I'd probably be running my cauldron business out of that. If other alchemists were willing to do that, we could have that portion of the guild accessible all over the map. Masons and Engineers need to travel to the buyer's town in order to make their creation. Alchemists and Smiths can either travel or can make the buyers come to them.

If we join the Guild, we'll be allowed to be a part of whatever city we want, right?
That may be another "problem". Most cities will be trying to get their own Crafters, and will probably expect free services as a part of that town... And if every town has their own crafters, they won't have much need for us. I guess we'll just hope for few crafters or something...

 

[Figgis]

I would love to take a more then member position if available in this Libra. (almost specced smith fyi, moving to mason next.)

On a side note though, I am a very generous person when it comes to big projects that I would think would be awesome and I know the person will pull them off, (as you know) maybe we could help sort of fund things like how you asked for donations for your bazaar, etc. Not saying all of it should go to that, but I am saying maybe a portion of what we earn could go towards huge ass projects that would be impossible if it was just one person gathering all the materials.

 

[TheTXLibra]

1. You can, of course, join any city you like. The Guild has no set city-type allegiance. I have no desire to run a city.

2. Cities might indeed have their own crafter(s) but take it from me when I say that's a real mixed bag for the Citizens. The people who are -willing- to do Crafting for free for their town might just not be the people they want doing it. I'm not going to name names, but as a former mayor twice, there are some people who will cheerfully, happily build things, really ugly things, for your city, for free, all day long.

3. If we can assume solidarity on our pricing, then city crafters who do have the skills to command payment might turn down the request for free craftwork when they know they could get money doing it elsewhere.

4. I'm sure some sort of discount could resolve this problem. Any CG member who wants to contribute fairly to the (and only to) the town they are a citizen of for half the normal guild-rate or something. This would encourage cities to use us if the grim thought of what "free crafting" often results in is not a large enough deterrant.

5. Cities that look like crap will die. Plain and simple. If the only way to get your city looking good while you have to defend it is to hire CG to make it pretty while you keep the area secure, then if you want your town to live, you'll tend to hire the best for city-projects.

6. Free people won't always be on.

7. I'm thinking membership dues will be needed for the guild hall, both to pay for regions and for the LWCs for shared resource boxes. So far I'm thinking 100c per member. It may sound a little steep at first, but it's actually pretty easy to obtain. I got that much from mobs in about 1-2 hours and I'm not even a warrior. This doesn't even count easy money like gold. The money would go towards paying for regions, LWCs, etc settling disputes between clients and The Guild. I don't want to set it too high because that would prevent too many from joining, but I also don't want it too low because the guild won't be able to pay its own bills otherwise. Also, it helps to keep out people who aren't serious, and to keep in those who are.

Okay, let's start a roster then. Who wants to go ahead and declare membership to The Crafter's Guild [CG] ?

 

[TheTXLibra]

Figgis, I'm falling asleep at the keyboard now, but promise I'll answer tomorrow. Short answer is, "yes, absolutely." We should do big projects to show the world who we are. And your generosity will never be forgotten, you are the awesome.

 

[Valalal]

Declares membership to The Crafter's Guild. =D

 

[MatTripp]

I Declare Membership to The Crafters Guild

 

[Diavolo1988]

This sounds like a great idea. The town of Newerth has a lot of crafter players already (I think Buddha is the only one who isnt right now) so Im sure many of us will join. Im waiting a little bit with joining for now. I dont have the money for membership fee atleast. My first priority when it comes to money is getting enugh for the specialisation fee.