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Suggestion Some changes that should be done.

Pampita

Legacy Supporter 3
Joined
Jan 30, 2012
Likes
32
Location
Raiding your town.
#1
So today i stated some suggestions that should be done to help the server on Offtopic chat, and decided that it should be posted on the forums and discussed
1. Market plugin and how it affects the Merchant class
The problem:
We all know the market is the best way to sell your stuff right now apart from trade chat. Since this doesn't have any restrictions on class/level, and it's way easier and faster to use than looking around Trade District like it used to be. Even if it's really useful and practical it pretty much removes the point on going the merchant class. What i am trying to say here is; Who will bother renting a Trade District shop, placing chestshops (Which cost 50s each) when you can just use one command, set a price and sell whatever item you want on the market, faster and without any kind of tax or fee. This not only affects the amount of shops, but also the amount of merchants, and the whole economy.
What I suggest:
I think the market should be restricted so only merchants are able to post items on them. This will not only help out the Shop Disctrict, Chestshops and Merchants but it will add a new kind of service aswell, since Merchants will be able to post stuff on the market for people for a small fee. There should be this new skill added which works just like "Black Market" called "Market" which allows Merchants to post items on it for a small fee, pretty much a faster Chestshop for when you need money faster. This could be added around level 30 (Please discuss)
Main Ideas:
  • Only merchants will be able to use the Market.
  • There will be a new skill added to the class which allows them to use it.
  • Trade Disctrict will be more active and more shops will be rented
  • ChestShops will start being used more
  • Merchants will have the chance of offering a new kind of service. (Posting items on the market for others).
  • There will be more Merchants and they will have a more active role on the economy.
2. Supporters perks, Herogates and random TP signs
The problem:
A few supporter perks have been removed lately, (Mainly speaking about Residences and Free Herogates).
okay, so the old residence plugin has been totally removed, the only ways to protect your stuff right now are either using LWC's or making/being part of a town. I don't think it was a bad idea at all, i mean, you can make a town for a single player for a pretty low price, but a high daily tax, this makes players have to be active to keep their stuff untouched. It's pretty useful, but removes one of the biggest perks of being a supporter.
This takes me to the other problem, Herogates, right now Herogates are free for everyone to use and spam, they also can be used during combat, bringing a little mess and fights in spawn, right now it's the main way of traveling on the server, which i think really hurts the PvP. What i am trying to say here is, now the whole world is PvP, but the only classes who get real PvP are rangers, since everyone is so far away on the map that there's rarely any PvP on central spots like there used to be, since most of them used to be Spawn Roads and now rarely anyone uses them, thanks you Random TP signs and Herogates.

What I suggest:
I think some more perks should be added to donors, perhaps related to voting (Depending on the tier people get x amount more of money and xp for voting), *(please feel free to post your ideas on here). Herogates must go back to costing 15s per use, it's not a high cost and it's really easy to get, random TP signs should be removed aswell. This will make people start using more spawn gates, making spawn more active and helping PvP out. Since alot of people would rather run 1000 more blocks than spending 15c.
Main Ideas:
  • More supporter perks should be added.
  • Herogates will go back to costing 15c per teleport (Free to tier 5+)
  • More people will use spawn gates.
  • PvP will be more active and spawn gates could go back to being central PvP areas.
  • People will stop camping the nexus waiting for people to go through a herogate to follow them, since they will not be as used.
  • Random TP signs located in spawn will be removed.
3. Noble plots and embassy plots
The problem:
Okay, so not long ago i decided to save some money for a spawn plot, i be been owning one for a few maps, they are really useful, a good way to save your stuff and also a great way to express your building potential in spawn. So after saving up for a while and buying it i found myself looking at the rules of them, since they were probably updated and i didn't want to break any rules which could lead me to being taken away from this plot i worked hard for. So, there rules say, there are 3 kinds of spawn plots, Noble plots, Embassy plots and Royal plots?. The rules also state that you can own only one Noble plot and one Royal plot, after reading a little further i saw that for one to have a Embassy plot for your town/guild you must have a 12k blocks or larger plot. According to the rules Embassy plots are only meant to represent your town in spawn and be a income to it, since you are allowed to place shops on them, but you can't use it for mass storage, since it would be the same as a Noble Plot. This takes me to the main problem why i made this post, none of this happens on the game.
There is only one standar size on all the spawn plots, they are 19x19x27 which is 9747 blocks big, so this means they are Noble plots and Royal plots which allow you to make Embassy plots are not out yet?. No, they are meant to be used as Embassy plots since all their names start with emb, after consulting a mod about it he confirmed it, they are all Embassy plots, there are No-Noble plots, No-Royal plots, only Embassy even if they are not 12k blocks big like the rules state they should be.
Well, okay, spawn was turned into a big spot to place all your Embassy's, it's not so bad, you can represent your town and earn a little money, even if you can't store your stuff, you can still do it in your town, it would be like that if only spawn was active and there would be a point in placing a chestshop inside your plot. Since the plots are located close to Spawn gates, and hardly anyone uses them other than the new players who just joined the server there's no-real point on them, no-one really sees them, and there's no-way you can get an income from them apart from all that you can't store stuff on them, making them useless.

What I suggest:
Spawn plots should be reworked, hardly anyone owns one, so they are easy to remove and remake. Different plots with different sizes and prices, should be made which would fill the both categories, Noble and Royal, some extra perks on owning an Embassy plot should be added, perhaps making it so Townspawn has no-cost when casted inside them or making some kind of special connection between the town and the plot, I believe that implementing the suggestions 1 and 2 listed above will help them aswell, making spawn more active and allowing plots to be seen, appreciated and used. PvP should be turned off inside them which only leads to killing new players inside them and a monthly tourney could be made aswell, giving a small prize to the best looking Embassy, encouraging people to make good looking building instead of ugly boxes.
Main Ideas:
  • New plots of different sizes and cost will be created, replacing the current standar size ones.
  • New perks to owning an Embassy plot will be added, such as free Townspawn when located inside it, or perhaps a portal which links the Embassy and the Town. (Could cost 5c to use, it's main purpose is helping town merchants restock the goods in them).
  • People will be allowed to choose if they want to turn their plot into an Embassy plot.
  • Monthly contests will be made, deciding the best looking Embassy and giving the town owner a small prize (Could be 2 keys). It's purpose is mainly encourage people on building a good looking plot.
  • PvP will be turned off inside spawn plots.
Please discuss about this thread and post your opinions about it.
 
Last edited:

draconis99

Holy
Retired Staff
Max Legacy Supporter
Joined
Feb 28, 2012
Likes
53
#3
1) I disagree.
2) I disagree.
3) I disagree.

I understand your concerns and frustration with the problems that came with the changes, however the "fixes" you desire are only reverting back to the problems they used to have and the reason they were changed.
- The marketplace allows for a centralized area without scattered shop boxes all throughout the map that never get used and are illegally used for storage. The admins didn't have time to deal with checking every merchant box to make sure they were following the rules, as well as keeping up to date with who was active enough to keep their box. Drama ensued as players demanded an "inactive" player's box be removed only to find he wasn't inactive and things were deleted.
- The reason rangers are the only viable pvp class in the wild, the herogates are the main form of transportation, pvp is scarce, and hubs are being camped is because of how large the map is. Previously, maps were much smaller and towns were neck to neck at each other's boundaries. While on your way to your town, you would pass by 3-4 towns on the way there. People used the roads because they were so close to town already. Due to lack of resources, maps had to be expanded to replenish the supply, and then the new maps defaulted at the larger size after a map wipe. Now, the maps are enormous, it is almost impossible to have a random encounter in the wild, and anything worth while is so far away that herogates have become necessary.
- Plots have become what they are because of people abusing them to avoid making towns, engaging in PVP, and hording their treasure they win from ganking other players. Now that they have so many rules and regulations, they aren't worth the headache most of the time. They weren't worth the headache before either. If there's something the staff hate, it's having to deal with the petty drama players create, and plots were one of them.

What I would suggest to fix the marketplace is instead of letting the marketplace be exclusively for merchants, slap a big tax on using the marketplace box. 20% of the proceeds gets eaten by the server. This will encourage merchants to set up their own shops at less of an overall price because they wont need to pay the taxes and raise their price. This will encourage players to go shop hunting for cheaper items by merchants. This will encourage more people to be/have a merchant in their group.

As for the herogates and lack of pvp, the answer is very simple, but impossible for this map: Shrink the map! Town plots were once something desired and a rare commodity because of the lack of land. Players would fight for the destruction of a town so that they could have the opportunity to place their town in its place, or expand their own town boundaries. With a smaller map, there will be more player encounters, more reasons to build towns as protected space is limited, as well as make the herogates not so far out as to give anyone a HUGE necessity if they are to explore anywhere. People normally play herocraft for 2 reasons: to build with their friends or to fight. Making building competative and increasing encounters for more chances to pvp is something I feel would stimulate the server, and probably speed it up with less resource drain.

I feel that plots as they are are more of a headache than a benefit. Though, if we change the marketplace to add a tax, more merchants will rent out plots and make their own shops. If we reduce the map size, more people will want to get plots due to a lack of space for their own towns but needing a safe place to logout. The rules behind the plots need to change, but they wont be changed until the community cries out for a change. As long as nobody cares about the plots or renting them, they wont complain for a change in the rules, and the rules will not change. I feel that if we change the marketplace and shrink the map, they community will decide on how to once again make plots a thriving part of the game instead of the graveyard it currently is.

Thoughts?
 
Joined
Jun 26, 2012
Likes
45
#4
@draconis99 ignoring your other two points cause I don't care, but you pretty much just ignored his suggestion about the herogates and said you disagreed with it. The 15c cost wasn't just removed for "better change" as far as I know something happened to the plugin so they never bothered fixing it. Herogates shouldn't just be done free teleport out to a town 5 blocks away from your town like almost all of the towns are. Also not to mention people use them to avoid death because it doesn't cost anything. It was never a problem before when it cost something.

As for a smaller map, that'd probably be good especially since they have a mining map now. Honestly they just need to change herogates or make a rule about making towns right fucking next to them. Especially since half the towns are boxes with lwc'd lifts...
 

WitchOnaRampage

Legacy Supporter 9
Joined
Jul 15, 2012
Likes
426
Location
Australia
#5
@Pampita, thanks for your considered post. Here are a few thoughts from me.

1. Market plugin, Merchant class, Trade District

The Global Market has taken a dominating role in the economy, I agree. It has deflated the economic viability not only of the Merchant class but also of all the Professions that have Chestshop perms for items their class specializes in.

I also see that having the Global Market right next to the Nexus gives players no reason to explore the Trade District, or indeed, any of the tiers of this marvellous spawn castle.

Perhaps in response to @draconis99’s suggestion in this thread, Kainzo has moved to make the Global Market less OP in that now 25% of a successful sale goes to the server (5% on creating the listing, 20% on sale).

I do, however, like the Global Market. I just think it should be made less OP.

I’m not in agreement with limiting Global Market access to Merchants because I think this would make them too powerful. I’d rather find a way of making Merchants more competitive compared with the Global Market.

My suggestions:
  • Relocate the Global Market and Mailboxes to the Trade District to encourage more traffic in the Trade District. Perhaps locate 4 Markets in corners away from the roadways to encourage players to walk past shops in more areas.
  • Manage the Market’s impact more by limiting the amount of time items remain there – by setting an expire_time in the config to one week (168 hours). (I think it must be currently set to 0 ie no expiry time.) I’ve done some research and haven’t been able to determine what happens to listings when they expire. I hope they are returned to the mailbox…
  • Move the Exchange to the TD too!!! Get players moving out from the spawn point.
Supporter perks, Herogates and random TP signs

Regarding your suggestions/requests:
  • I noticed Kainzo saying today in chat that Herogate fees will be coming back in. (They have been fee-free for some time because the plugin was broken, not because of lack of will to have them charge a fee.)
  • Kainzo has also mentioned that finding a solution for personal regions will be a high priority after this Dungeons release has been bedded in.
As with the Global Market, my concern with the random TP signs is that they are located at spawn and so there’s no incentive for players to move out from spawn/nexus/Exchange area.

@Pampita I’m not clear what you mean by spawn gates – do you mean the roadways out of spawn where they become pvp on? I see your point about the value of having more focus/choke points where pvp is likely to occur.

My suggestions:
  • Relocate the random TP signs away from the central spawn point to encourage players to look outward. Perhaps they could go on the roads out of spawn outside the pvp off zone, although this might create hotspots that are a little too hot :D. Perhaps even just on a lower level of spawn, maybe on the roads through the TD.
  • Perhaps consider charging a low fee for the random TP signs. (I’m not so sure about this as they are probably mostly used by new players who have no money. Is it (1) possible to charge a fee, and (2) possible to check how long a player has been on the server before deciding to charge the fee….?)
  • Investigate whether it’s possible for Herogates to be only usable if you’re not combat-tagged.
Noble Plots and Embassy Plots

The Embassy rules as they currently stand were actually formulated to go with a townships plugin that didn’t end up getting used on this map. While it’s possible to have an Embassy with Towny, atm there doesn’t seem to be any reason to do so.

I think we still need to balance Towny more for this map so that we get the growth of a good number of active, sizeable towns. After that happens, the need for Embassy plots could be considered further.

And I’ve always been an opponent of Noble Plots because every map I’ve been here I’ve watched town activity plummet as soon as Noble Plots are released. They’re not my thing :p
 
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