[Skill] Dragoon skills discussion and proposal.

[Mellowbeatz]

As some of you may know the dragoon is literally limited to 5 skills, two of them that don't work towards actual intentions, two of them dealing minimal damage, and lastly one that is just mobility. A Dragoon is known as a Cavalry-man, someone with high mobility, huge intimidation and 'just-in-the-knick- of-time' attacks. The Dragoon is a HUGE mobility attacker with a minor slowing ability and a small AoE.

Now don't get me wrong, I love the Dragoon class mostly just because he can harass his/her target like a gnat. The only thing that gets me down about him is that, that's just it he/she can only harass. Back in the days where the term Dragoon was actually used, it was almost considered a trump card to have two or three in the battlefield. Now realistically, I have no idea what the real intentions towards this class are, but moving around shouldn't be the only one.

As of now the Dragoon's last move is currently under construction which is fair since i've only seen it on the test server and Kainzo is pressed with more important matters, but that puts the Dragoon at a rather sloped disadvantage in which he cannot just simply use jump to get over. This is in no way intended to bring all of the attention to this class, as I'm sure the other classes are probably under construction too. This is to simply raise awareness that Dragoons aren't as powerful as you might take them to be and need some love.

Now before this becomes TL;DR material, I'd like you to view a skill proposal of mine.

Trample
This skills intended purpose is to make fighting someone (Or a load of people.) a bit easier.
-Skill description: Tramples your foes by running through them and slowing them.
-Skill example: When you use this ability you gain a .5 speed boost, a 2 block AoE 5hp damage and slow lasting 10 seconds while the ability lasts 7 seconds. Currently thinking, an Mp cost would equal something of 10 and the cool-down would be 30 so you couldn't spam the crap out of it.

This ability is very versatile. It can handle loads of mobs while not dealing mind-blowing damage, and it can benefit your team greatly if you used it on an opposing team. Not only does it help fighting, but imagine running away .5 faster while they're moving .5 slower.

Thank you for taking the time to review this skill/discussion, and critique/question it.

 

[Alator]

Just throwing this out there:

The herocraft Dragoon is modeled after the Final Fantasy version, not the cavalry version, the skils of which are pretty much identical to their FFinal Fantasy counterpart, haha:

"The Dragoon (竜騎士 Ryūkishi?) (also known as Dragon Knight or Lancer) uses spears and their Jump ability and usually wears heavy armor. Jump typically does double damage when the user is wielding a spear, and removes the Dragon Knight from combat for one round. While jumping, Dragoons either thrust downward with their spears to skewer enemies, or toss the weapon at the foe from above."

Anyway, now that I got my lore nerding out of the way, Trample would be a one hit per enemy, or would it work on a tick? Maybe once every 2-3 seconds? Be like taking massive leaping steps that have an effect on every impact.

 

[Mellowbeatz]

Oh god. I think I've totally misunderstood the intentions, I cannot believe I didn't think of the Final fantasy Dragoon.. However, yes Trample would be a ticking ability where it damages someone who is just standing still.

 

[applelove]

^ I'm playing dragoon for two reasons. 1. They're excellent at escape, and I hate being murdered. 2. Kain in FF4 is awesome <3
I haven't pvped enough to add much to any related discussion, but I have noticed that even now, pvp matches are usually fairly short. I think things like slow and root should really be limited to a few seconds, enough to get a few hits or run 10-20 blocks away, but not nearly enough to obliterate a target. I think 10 seconds is probably too much for any skill that slows a target.

To add something else to the discussion: As I understand it, super jump is supposed to be used with quake, basically a big jump (as dragoons are famous for!) to damage everyone in the area. Donno if that's what super jump is really intended to do, but at the moment, it doesn't do that. The safe fall is about 3-5 seconds too long, so even from a 10-15 block elevation from your target, your safefall wears off long after you hit the ground. I've used it to safely descend from the top of the test server spawn building.

Someone who has pvped more will have to give feedback on how dragoons actually handle themselves in a fight.

 

[Oxea]

Dragoons can do way more than harass, we can kill. With the latest version of the Dragoon having more skills than the last time I played, I see that both 1v1 and team fights especially to be more dominating but yes skill still plays a large factor. I honestly reckon Quake should have the slow effect added on as you've suggested for Trample, it makes sense right?

 

[applelove]

Or the "knocked down" effect, where the player model is turned sideways and put on the ground =D

Slow on quake might be a little unnecessary, expecially since quake is passive. Every time you fall for 5-6 blocks, your walking buddies would be slowed, unless you're in a party.

 

[Spicycheez]

Tbh, I don't really get the point of quake. You have to kill yourself just to do like (25?) damage to surrounding players and mobs. The only time I could think of using quake is when your town/base is getting raided. Spawn in the sky and just keep jumping down and killing yourself xD

 

[MeganPerk]

Unless of course dragoons had a half fall damage passive skill from jumping around so much... that way their enemies take the damage the dragoon WOULD have recieved from quake, while the damage the dragoons would have recieved is halved. Taking the safefall off of jump would also allow jump to be an attacking skill with quake in this fashion. I tried suggesting this earlier but only got flamed out because of it, but I figured I'd throw it out there again.

 

[Mellowbeatz]

So it really all just falls down to where they want to take this class into which direction. This class definitely has potential to be something greater, it just hasn't been found yet.

Putting it into an offensive approach leads it helpless to escape.

Putting it into an escape approach leads it to being useless in offense.

Putting it into a Half offense half escape leads it to being OP.

I think it might just be better to leave it as is.. Minus the buggy final.

 

[Dazureus]

Unless of course dragoons had a half fall damage passive skill from jumping around so much... that way their enemies take the damage the dragoon WOULD have recieved from quake, while the damage the dragoons would have recieved is halved. Taking the safefall off of jump would also allow jump to be an attacking skill with quake in this fashion. I tried suggesting this earlier but only got flamed out because of it, but I figured I'd throw it out there again.

...you're kind of stuck on this, aren't you?

As far as Quake goes, having Dragoons take reduced fall damage at all times is a good idea. They take less damage, and Quake can deal more without getting OP.

But past experiences show that removing safety on Jump leads to a lot of needless damage. And half of that is still punishment for finding uses for Jump. We've been over the fact that Jump outside of PvP is not bad, haven't we? If you can find a way to let Jump be used to traverse an uneven landscape without collateral damage while still keeping them from using it to avoid that fall damage you seem to be worried about (while also keeping things reasonable for the coders), I am all ears. Note that I can't guarantee the same for the rest of Herocraft.

So help me if people have flamed you since I started writing this post, I will... probably facepalm.
EDIT: success! Facepalm averted.

 

[Malphugus]

Hmm, I dunno.
I don't PvP much but dragoon felt pretty balanced PvE-wise. Being warriors, they are a low-damage/high-armor class and have a mobility advantage that the other warrior specs don't have. Armor is better than it used to be too, not losing much (or any?) of it's protective value as it's durability is worn down.
Imo they don't need much more tweaking (apart from fixing, or coming up with a replacement for, superjump) unless they have real problems in PvP

 

[Malphugus]

Hmm, I dunno.
I don't PvP much but dragoon felt pretty balanced PvE-wise. Being warriors, they are a low-damage/high-armor class and have a mobility advantage that the other warrior specs don't have. Armor is better than it used to be too, not losing much (or any?) of it's protective value as it's durability is worn down.
Imo they don't need much more tweaking (apart from fixing, or coming up with a replacement for, superjump) unless they have real problems in PvP

OMG superjump is Awesome

From the ground to the spawn spot (i.e. right at the top of the structure) in test is 2 superjumps. Just have to have enough mana to superjump + jump. Wait a little to regen mana and repeat.

Also: superjump = safefall. Jumped off the top and hit superjump almost immediately . . .nocheat kicked in and landed me, no damage sustained.

 

[Dazureus]

Have we found out exactly how many blocks Superjump propels you? I can use Jump to get up 4 blocks in one bound. My levels got reset somewhere between me getting Dragoon on Test and them fixing Superjump.

 

[Malphugus]

Hmm, it's not fixed. Applelove just found a way around the problem.
If you move at all after using SJ it looks like 15 blocks straight up, then you get teleported back to the block where you started.
However, if you don't move then you get up to about 35 blocks, and fall back to earth (no teleport). But of course that's just straight up and back down again, not very useful.`

However, if you use jump just after superjump it seems to kick in at/near the top of the superjump and you are propelled forward 4 or 5 blocks.

It's a little tricky getting the timing right but I managed to use it well both with improvedchat keybinds and using two tools and the /bind command.

note: given that it's the nocheat mod that is interfering with it, I wouldn't count on superjump always behaving like this. It might not even go live like this...

 

[Papabear20xd6]

Agree with the fact that dragoons need more skills. I think they are a really cool class and can be really good but a lot of people don't stick with them because they don't have enough skill to make it exiting.