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Suggestion Rogues with bows.

TheTMTrainer

Soulsand
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
I feel it is a little wierd going from a Class, specializing is close range stealth, suddenly becoming a master ranger or bard, using a bow the entire time.

I was thinking Rogues could adopt the use of bows, perhaps 5-6 damage per arrow? Then when people spec they can choose what they want to specialize in, Ranger/Bard, or Ninja/Thief.

No. It has been this way for forever. Bards just got the bow not to long ago.

But what would be so bad about giving another class a ranged advantage? In a way I see this as a somewhat needed buff.

PreSpecs are not suppose to be powerful in any shape or form.
Because they have a melee advantage.
Ninja and thief do 12 and 14 w/ a diamond sword.

Rogues do 7 damage with a sword, and besides, giving them a bow won't make them any more powerful, other than, if they can aim, the first strike (casters typicly get the first strike anyway).

I repeat PreSpecs are supposed to be extremely weak.

Giving Rogues a bow won't do anything.

Where are they going to find arrows? Unless they have been playing a different class for a while.

They get arrows by kill skeletons or crafting them.

Well, obviously, but beforehand, they need to use a sword, forcing them to try to swing their way through. Even if they dislike using swords, they need to use it for the low levels. Bows lack blocks, plus they can't use Assassin's Blade if they use a bow.

In it self, it doesn't give Rogues higher damage, they can't spawn arrows like Rangers, and they lack skills, such as Bards, such as Might or Pulse, that boosts your damage and keeps enemys at bay. Casters can snipe mobs without a problem, Rogues get a reagent costing (arrow) debuffing (you need to charge your arrow, and you move slower when you draw back) and protentialy slow ranged attack, that does as much as a stone sword. It won't make them stronger.
 

Hydroking77

Legacy Supporter 7
Joined
Aug 23, 2011
No. It has been this way for forever. Bards just got the bow not to long ago.

PreSpecs are not suppose to be powerful in any shape or form.
Because they have a melee advantage.
Ninja and thief do 12 and 14 w/ a diamond sword.

I repeat PreSpecs are supposed to be extremely weak.

They get arrows by kill skeletons or crafting them.
 

TheTMTrainer

Soulsand
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
I'm not wholesomely opposed to the idea of allowing rogues to use both from path to spec. We could let the damage be 6-7 and it still wouldnt change much. It may be the solution to close gaps with casters.
*cough*

Thank you for the reply Kainzo, I personaly think 6 damage would be the way to go, or even 5 damage, because it is easy to make a stone sword, but 7 damage would be over powered, considering Iron swords do that much, and they cost a lot more.
 

Kainzo

The Disposable Hero
Staff member
Founder
Adventure Team
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Location
The 7th Circle of Heaven
Could you put that on the 1.2 server, so I could test it out?
Yeah, no problemo - just to note, "it's like this because it's always been like this" isn't always the best argument or defense. Some things are flawed and its a work in progress. However, I do believe that we have a great setup here on Herocraft, there's always room for improvement.
 

Hydroking77

Legacy Supporter 7
Joined
Aug 23, 2011
I don't like change :p
But I never thought of it as a gap closer. It is more of a keep the gap wide. When I think of a gap closer, I'm imagine a speed buff. This will in fact in my world keep the gap wide as both the caster and the rogue will hang back.
 

Aetosion

Obsidian
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
I agree with Hydro's most recent comment. A ranged attack doesn't close gaps, doesn't allow the rogue to get close and use a sword. A speed boost gives that advantage.

The rogue will end up shooting shit from trees, acting like a much-weaker caster.


However, I don't see the harm in adding a 5-6 damage bow for a week or so and see how it works out.
 

Theazian

Legacy Supporter 3
Joined
Sep 2, 2011
Location
Hiding under a rock
I'm not wholesomely opposed to the idea of allowing rogues to use bow from path to spec. We could let the damage be 6-7 and it still wouldnt change much. It may be the solution to close gaps with casters.

I think if there's rogues getting ranged weapons, healers should have some sort of buff. Perhaps something like a ward at level 25? Could be cast on yourself or others, giving like 30 seconds of a defence buff?
 

Aetosion

Obsidian
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Or add Projectile Protection I back.

My fear with giving rogues both Ranged and Melee advantages in early levels will discourage using Caster/Healer (Just ranged) and Warrior (Just melee). Alot of what class choices come down to is the ease in leveling to spec. That's why I've never spec'd into a Healer class, and the same reason why most don't do the same thing. With this change I think you'd end up with an overflow of Rogues, probably ending up as Rangers after using the bow in leveling their path.

TC;CU Too Convoluted; Couldn't Understand - This won't affect PVP at all, but may make it too easy for Rogues to level, causing an overflow of Rogues.
 

TheTMTrainer

Soulsand
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Or add Projectile Protection I back.

My fear with giving rogues both Ranged and Melee advantages in early levels will discourage using Caster/Healer (Just ranged) and Warrior (Just melee). Alot of what class choices come down to is the ease in leveling to spec. That's why I've never spec'd into a Healer class, and the same reason why most don't do the same thing. With this change I think you'd end up with an overflow of Rogues, probably ending up as Rangers after using the bow in leveling their path.

TC;CU Too Convoluted; Couldn't Understand - This won't affect PVP at all, but may make it too easy for Rogues to level, causing an overflow of Rogues.

Other than Rangers, who have been asking for a nerf, bow addicted Rouges would have to resort to Bard, whom still does low damage with a bow up to level 43 or so when he gets pulse. Sure, more Rogues might have a slight bit more freedom, but what happens if they dislike all 4 of their specs?

And it will effect PvP in the sense that a class can actualy hit a caster :eek:
 

Aetosion

Obsidian
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
I'm a Master Wizard.

Are you implying I killed you? :O
I mean, I probably did at some point in time, I attack whoever I see.
 

Aetosion

Obsidian
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Woops. Anywho, you're one of my 126 kills. I have like... 344 deaths though.

*runs around as a level 14 caster, gets raped*

Aetosion - *Wonders why his K/D is shit*

I only got about 150ish deaths from pre-spec :p

I got like, +20 deaths today and only +2 kills. I kept bum rushing Panorama and getting ganked by 7+ defenders. I have really bad judgement with that stuff. Lol.
 

Kainzo

The Disposable Hero
Staff member
Founder
Adventure Team
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Location
The 7th Circle of Heaven
Giving rogue's bows will further separate them from warriors - which is needed. Currently warriors have a large arm over them with armor.
 

TheTMTrainer

Soulsand
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Giving rogue's bows will further separate them from warriors - which is needed. Currently warriors have a large arm over them with armor.

So, how are things going in the 1.2 server? The way your talking, Rogues are going to get bows.
 
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