Rogue Quick Bandaid Fix (little to no work)

[LordSeven]

This is a bandaid fix for rogue that will help out until a more permanent solution can be found.

I haven't been playing long, but it is was made obvious to me that rogue needs a pve buff. I grouped with every base class, and when the healer has better damage then the rogue, you know there is an issue.

I suggest you move the AssassinsBlade to a level 1 rogue skill, afterall, the other classes get an early damaging skill. I also propose you lower damage of AssassinsBlade to 1 per tick but make it tick every second and a half over 12 seconds. Perhaps, raise the manacost to 30-35 and increase the duration of how long the buff lasts. This will help out both pvp and pve as a mini cc. You can then move Sneak and Kick to level 10 and 20 respectively.

 

[Dazureus]

Um, huh? "the Healer has better damage than the Rogue" what now? Are you talking about Smite?

If that's your issue, be aware that Smite uses mana and has a cooldown, whereas a Rogue with an iron sword can deal 7 damage quickly with no mana or cooldown.

Fireball is Caster's main form of attack, and Healers need some way to PvE at least somewhat efficiently. The melee classes don't have this issue and (according to the wiki) Warrior only gets Bite at level 20 anyways.

As for actually tweaking Assassin's Blade, I have no input. Just making sure that you have a proper understanding of the overall situation.

 

[LordSeven]

A 7 damage weapon (currently takes 6 hits to kill a zombie) does no good when your health is so low that you cannot safely fight. Also, just forget even trying to kill a creeper. Due to the relative squishness, lack of any sustain, and their inability to do any sort of ranged until they get kick, (which still has a short range and does very low damage on a high cooldown) low level rogues have a much tougher time then the other classes in pve. Yes I agree, that a rogue's melee weapon does more then a healer's melee weapon. However, the amount of time a rogue can safely melee until they are low health allows a healer to outdps them. I partied with a healer and they were healing me quite often and they still managed more damage then me. Think of it like this, if the healer smites right away, that's 10 damage, if they smite again in 5 seconds, that's another 10 damage, 20 damage in 5 seconds, from range with little to no risk. I would highly recommend playing a rogue and seeing for yourself exactly what I'm talking about.

 

[GreekCrackShot]

level

 

[Dazureus]

I as a Caster can safely melee creepers with a weapon that deals 2hp per hit. It's annoying and inefficient but absolutely possible.

Due to the lag inherent in SMP Minecraft (and/or tweakery by Kainzo, I hear) you can't hit spiders to stop their jumps, but you can walk circles around them, like zombies. Skeletons are tougher but if you as a Rogue are landing hits quickly you shouldn't suffer more than one arrow per encounter. If you're having trouble with group combat do your best to catch the attention of only one or two at a time. And rest in between fights if you have to. I would recommend that you switch to Caster if you don't quite get how to pace yourself.

EDIT: also level

 

[Sweord]

Okay, just want to throw this in here: According to the wiki, healer and rogue start with 41 health. Both gain 1 HP per level. Therefore, rogues get the same amount of health as healers do until healers spec. So saying that a healer can out DPS them is a little BS. They get one 10 health smite that has a cooldown of 7 secs. Stay inside an unspec'd healer's range and and you should be able to do more damage than they can bandage up.

(Edited for spelling and typos)

 

[LordSeven]

I'm level 25 now after 2 days.
@ Dazureus I would really recommend you trying to level rogue past 14, even level 24 is challenging. I don't think you really know how difficult it is unless you try it. It's even harder when you don't start with whatever gear you want. and lol at your recommendation to switch to caster.
@ Sweord This isn't about pvp, this is about pve. Healers can heal themselves in a fight by running and then using their smite spam. They also can heal themselves after combat and immediately be ready for the next mob. I would really recommend you trying to level rogue past 14, even level 24 is challenging.

 

[GreekCrackShot]

what the hell is up with everyone saying rouge instead of rogue? xD

rouge = a shade of red

 

[GreekCrackShot]

also kick a healer while they're using bandage - it stops its warmup

Wear armor fighting mobs.

 

[Gunmoney321]

May I add to this? If so, listen to this little bit of opinion:
When I played as rogue, I noticed that I had very little methods in the way of attack skills. Aside from the fact that there was my trust iron sword, I found myself not being able to do any sort of efficient damage. Also, the whole only leather and gold is a bit of BS in my opinion. One, I can never find cows, Two, any weapon, except maybe wooden swords, can cut through a set of Leather armor like a hot knife through butter (Am I getting that mixed up? )

 

[Dazureus]

I think my words are falling on deaf eyeballs.

If you are not dealing damage efficiently, it's your fault. The tools are there and I've seen them used properly. You can kill things without dying if you understand the mobs' patterns and use them to your advantage. I never had a real problem with this. I just picked it up. Maybe that's why half the things shhninja is typing are so weird to me.

 

[Dazureus]

what the hell is up with everyone saying rouge instead of rogue? xD

rouge = a shade of red

I always go rogue. I never go rouge.

 

[Gunmoney321]

I think my words are falling on deaf eyeballs.

If you are not dealing damage efficiently, it's your fault. The tools are there and I've seen them used properly. You can kill things without dying if you understand the mobs' patterns and use them to your advantage. I never had a real problem with this. I just picked it up. Maybe that's why half the things shhninja is typing are so weird to me.

Hahaha, now it's fine for me, I'm Ranger Also, to Mr. Ninja, like Dazureus said, just try and recognize the mob patterns, and do your best to stay away from PvP fights, unless you have a healer and/or a decent tank. Save money and purchase leather armors. If you need a training buddy or something, I'm up for it

 

[LordSeven]

I love how the caster, who hasn't even tried to play rogue, is telling me

If you are not dealing damage efficiently, it's your fault.

I find this kind of insulting actually, as he is assuming that I am playing incorrectly or incompetently.
I'm already level 25 after 2 days, I said it was more difficult to level then other classes, not impossible.
I plan on going ranger myself because the other alternatives are less then appealing atm.

 

[Gunmoney321]

I love how the caster, who hasn't even tried to play rogue, is telling me

I find this kind of insulting actually, as he is assuming that I am playing incorrectly.
I'm already level 25 after 2 days, I said it was more difficult to level then other classes, not impossible.
I plan on going ranger myself because the other alternatives are less then appealing atm.

My friend Mrchucklez had at first specced as Ninja, because he figure it was high DPS, but he tells me that it has almost no attack skills, aside from Ablade.

 

[Dazureus]

I love how the caster, who hasn't even tried to play rogue, is telling me

I find this kind of insulting actually, as he is assuming that I am playing incorrectly or incompetently.
I'm already level 25 after 2 days, I said it was more difficult to level then other classes, not impossible.
I plan on going ranger myself because the other alternatives are less then appealing atm.

I only say that because in my experience, it's the truth. Before I was a Caster I was a (usually unarmored) Warrior. I found avoiding attacks to be pretty easy. I'd take an arrow here and there but it's not difficult to handle melee mobs and creepers. Not to mention that I've been in parties with plenty of Rogues who flashed red once every five minutes or so.

You don' know me! You don' know mah struggles!

Additionally, if you've almost mastered the class over the course of two days why are you even posting? When you say it's harder to level Rogue, do you KNOW that? Have you been a Healer, a Warrior and a Caster already? Do you know what leveling Rogue SHOULD be like? Do you understand that personal experience, while helpful, is not the sole deciding factor when it comes to the validity of a person's input?

 

[Jinder745]

My friend Mrchucklez had at first specced as Ninja, because he figure it was high DPS, but he tells me that it has almost no attack skills, aside from Ablade.

Kick? Garrote? And Blackjack is useful

 

[Gunmoney321]

Kick? Garrote? And Blackjack is useful

Hmmm, well you must understand that this information is coming form Mrchucklez, as I have no experience with Ninja

 

[LordSeven]

I only say that because in my experience, it's the truth.

You are a troll.
I only say that because in my experience, it's the truth.

Additionally, if you've almost mastered the class over the course of two days why are you even posting?

I'm posting this to try to make the game better for other people. I know it's hard for you to imagine, but I'm suggesting a change to the game that won't effect my own character. I plan on going Ranger regardless of if the changes I suggested make it through. Right now my experience with the class feels like I'm playing a fighter who is squishy as hell and not a rogue.

To answer your other questions, I have intimate knowledge of all of the skills in Herocraft.

 

[KrunknMunky]

Man you are pretty stubborn! I leveled rogue, and am now a specced Thief, rogues are in fact pretty easy to level if you play properly, you just need to get into the right mindset! Don't go charging at a skeleton and expect to come out with huge amounts of health! Strafe in and out, move faster than the skeleton can aim!

In my opinion, and experience, rogues are an easy class to level! You have the second highest damage output (casters just rape), you still have relatively decent health, and you have kick, which knocks mobs back significantly, as well as dealing a little damage, I don't understand what the problem here is. This is a hardcore server, and you will die a lot.