Suggestion Ranger suggestion.

[CoolBeans279]

Know what time it is? Rouge balancing time! so i thought now would be a good time to say what i think about Ranger's current place.

So to start, arrows do way to much damage. When a ranger is running 30-40 agi (average) they're doing close to 200 per hit, that's just insane.

Another issue is its damage with an axe (its secondary weapon) with a diamond one it deals 56 base damage. That's 10 more than Dreadknight, 9 more than Paladin, 2 more than Berserker and 2 more than Dragoon. Meaning a Ranger using its secondary weapon does more damage than every warrior.

Another little issue is the fact that a ranger can have 50 weight and still have good Agility/Con.

Something i see as a problem is punch 2 bow, removing punch all together could be a good choice.

I guess this isn't really a suggestion, but mainly pointing out the bigger problems with Rangers current place.​

Thank's for reading!
​

[USERGROUP=38]@Balance Team[/USERGROUP]

 

[JupiterRome]

Rangers been broken ever since I started playing, Can we like not change its hard to get used to fighting against them Again?

BTW Just for certain people Yeah I bitch about arrow spam and punch II = crying everytime I die, then when I bring up the fact that 1 arrow is 1 empathy without a cd cuz apparently dks op

 

[malikdanab]

Rogues will always have higher higher damage than warriors, but I agree 56 is too high. The problem becomes that if you make Rangers melee/bow damage reasonable, the class itself will become UP. This is mainly due to its lack of COMBAT skills. Ranger only has 2 bow-based damage skills. Everything else is used to position itself so it can use its bow. Another things, what's with giving ranger (a ranged class...DUH) more armor weight and HP than melee classes? What I would do without a full rework:

Bow-

• Damage: 35->20 (With bow strength and full draw 168->96)

Axe-

• Damage: 56->48

Armor-

• 32->27 (Overall loss of 5 weight / 4% armor)

HP-

• 630->580

Even though this should make the class more in line, the main problem that the class in general is just about kiting and using its bow doesn't change. What I would really want:

• Reduce rangers base stats
• give ranger actual combat skills

But these stats are all based on bring the class in line with other rogues...but even those aren't balance. For actual numbers we need to wait til we go over rogues in general.

Time for the hate to roll in...

 

[CoolBeans279]

Rogues will always have higher higher damage than warriors, but I agree 56 is too high. The problem becomes that if you make Rangers melee/bow damage reasonable, the class itself will become UP. This is mainly due to its lack of COMBAT skills. Ranger only has 2 bow-based damage skills. Everything else is used to position itself so it can use its bow. Another things, what's with giving ranger (a ranged class...DUH) more armor weight and HP than melee classes? What I would do without a full rework:

Bow-

• Damage: 35->20 (With bow strength and full draw 168->144)

Axe-

• Damage: 56->48

Armor-

• 32->27 (Overall loss of 5 weight / 4% armor)

HP-

• 630->580

Even though this should make the class more in line, the main problem that the class in general is just about kiting and using its bow doesn't change. What I would really want:

• Reduce rangers base stats
• give ranger actual combat skills

But these stats are all based on bring the class in line with other rogues...but even those aren't balance. For actual numbers we need to wait til we go over rogues in general.

Time for the hate to roll in...

I knew i forgot something - Ranger is lacking skills.

 

[Irishman81]

I agree that the damage can be a little high, but I sometimes think that's good. I mean, no offense to the rangers of herocraft, but there just aren't many good ones. Maybe some of the rangers you fight can land a ton of shots, and the class seems rediculous. But in my experience, the rangers I fight get a couple shots in, then either run or start spamming arrows. Idk just a thought.

 

[RShooter2000]

I agree that the damage can be a little high, but I sometimes think that's good. I mean, no offense to the rangers of herocraft, but there just aren't many good ones. Maybe some of the rangers you fight can land a ton of shots, and the class seems rediculous. But in my experience, the rangers I fight get a couple shots in, then either run or start spamming arrows. Idk just a thought.

Ranger doesn't take much skill to use though, explosive shot and a damage nuke with a low cooldown makes for easy kills, ecspecially since prot armor was basically removed. I agree with Malik it just needs some damage reductions and stat changes. Even if there aren't any "good" rangers, I don't think we should base that off of how a class should be looked at or balanced.

I agree that the scaling of agility and projectile damage needs a bit of a reduction, Ninja and Ranger both have crazy bow damage.

Ranger has 4 damage/attack bow skills, Explosive Shot, Envenom, Ice Volley, and Aimed Shot.

 

[JupiterRome]

Ranger doesn't take much skill to use though, explosive shot and a damage nuke with a low cooldown makes for easy kills, ecspecially since prot armor was basically removed. I agree with Malik it just needs some damage reductions and stat changes. Even if there aren't any "good" rangers, I don't think we should base that off of how a class should be looked at or balanced.

I agree that the scaling of agility and projectile damage needs a bit of a reduction, Ninja and Ranger both have crazy bow damage.

Ranger has 4 damage/attack bow skills, Explosive Shot, Envenom, Ice Volley, and Aimed Shot.

I love how nobody Pointed out Prot was removed cuz rangers couldn't do anything against it.
Can we fucking talk about punch?

 

[malikdanab]

I love how nobody Pointed out Prot was removed cuz rangers couldn't do anything against it.
Can we fucking talk about punch?

Nothing to talk about. Punch and knockback should be removed forever...while we are at it remove flame and fireaspect

 

[CoolBeans279]

I agree that the damage can be a little high, but I sometimes think that's good. I mean, no offense to the rangers of herocraft, but there just aren't many good ones. Maybe some of the rangers you fight can land a ton of shots, and the class seems rediculous. But in my experience, the rangers I fight get a couple shots in, then either run or start spamming arrows. Idk just a thought.

Yeah i agree, the damage may not be to high because of the fact that most people cant aim.

BUT whenever someone has a punch II bow 90% of the time they hit you once and its like an infinite stun because of nocheat, then they get 10 free arrow hits and you're dead. :/

 

[SurvivalManZ]

Rouges haven't been discussed much YET by balance, so i thought i'd say what i think about Ranger's current place.

So to start, arrows do way to much damage. When a ranger is running 30-40 agi (average) they're doing close to 200 per hit, that's just insane.

Another issue is its damage with an axe (its secondary weapon) with a diamond one it deals 56 base damage. That's 10 more than Dreadknight, 9 more than Paladin, 6 more than Berserker and 2 more than Dragoon. Meaning a Ranger using its secondary weapon does more damage than every warrior.


My suggestion is lowering the base damage on axes, and decrease the scaling of arrows with agility.

Another little issue is the fact that a ranger can have 50 weight and still have good Agility/Strength.

Thank's for reading!
​

[USERGROUP=38]@Balance Team[/USERGROUP]

XD! You're using my build in your example. 50 armor with OP arrow dmg.

AS for my opinion, I say that Ranger melee dmg should be decreased DRAMATICALLY, but keep the bow dog the same. I mean, really. The Ranger is supposed to have a good bow. Why nerf the arrow strength?

 

[malikdanab]

XD! You're using my build in your example. 50 armor with OP arrow dmg.

AS for my opinion, I say that Ranger melee dmg should be decreased DRAMATICALLY, but keep the bow dog the same. I mean, really. The Ranger is supposed to have a good bow. Why nerf the arrow strength?

Theres excelling in bow damage, but then theres having much superior DPS compared to a melee class while retaining its range advantage.

 

[Irishman81]

Theres excelling in bow damage, but then theres having much superior DPS compared to a melee class while retaining its range advantage.

And when you bring punch into the picture, the damage+knock back can really annoy you

 

[SurvivalManZ]

Theres excelling in bow damage, but then theres having much superior DPS compared to a melee class while retaining its range advantage.

Yea, I getcha now.

 

[SurvivalManZ]

Theres excelling in bow damage, but then theres having much superior DPS compared to a melee class while retaining its range advantage.

So what do you suggest?

 

[CoolBeans279]

XD! You're using my build in your example. 50 armor with OP arrow dmg.

AS for my opinion, I say that Ranger melee dmg should be decreased DRAMATICALLY, but keep the bow dog the same. I mean, really. The Ranger is supposed to have a good bow. Why nerf the arrow strength?

I would never try to base any balance off anything related to you because you're just bad no offense.

A lot of rangers run 50 weight, and i was just saying that's its POSSIBLE i wasn't saying everyone or a single person does that.

And no, melee damage shouldn't be dramatically decreased, Malik's suggestion is perfect.

Also i don't think you're the one to ask for Ranger balancing, as you've only played Ranger. IMO you shouldn't be allowed to even be involved with the balancing of Ranger when the time comes, but that's Kainzo's choice not mine. (Seriously no offense meant here, its just not a bright idea.)

Bow-

• Damage: 35->20 (With bow strength and full draw 168->144)

Axe-

• Damage: 56->48

Armor-

• 32->27 (Overall loss of 5 weight / 4% armor)

HP-

• 630->580

Time for the hate to roll in...

This is all that it needs, and overall maybe it could get another skill? like i said that'll have to be decided upon once the balancing of rouges come.

And when you bring punch into the picture, the damage+knock back can really annoy you

This is a big issue with no-cheat as well, if you get hit by a punch 2 bow while in the air its basically a stun allowing them to get a couple more shots off, and with the high damage those few shots can mean 400 HP.


@SurvivalManZ No reason to f-palm my post. You're balance now, please act like a big boy.

 

[malikdanab]

I messed up with the math yesterday...anyway. In terms of damage bows scale much more than compared to melee. For reference:

Per Str: 0.35
Per Agi: 0.888

Even without scaling, rangers base damage of "35" actually becomes 168 damage. So even without adding a point of AGI rangers will be dealing more damage than ANY melee class (In terms of left clicks vs. Arrows).

About the mess up yesterday...I originally thought of reducing the damage by 5 to 30. This would give the 144 damage, but even then thats too high. Thats why I considered dropping it further to 20. 96 may seem really low, but with 30 AGI thats an extra 26 damage for 122 damage total. This would bring rangers damage belows other rogues, but it will still have the advantage of range.

That said, this is if ranger where to keep its above normal tankiness. If that was to be nerfed to make it an actual weak ranged class, a compromise of 25 base damage (120) would be reasonable.

 

[LightningCape]

Always been against tanky ranger. It was mainly in to help rangers who had trouble landing arrows but with explosiveshot and aimedshot aiming has become drastically easier.

 

[JupiterRome]

Not reading everything but,
I think Bow Strength Kinda increases arrow spam

 

[malikdanab]

Not reading everything but,
I think Bow Strength Kinda increases arrow spam

Bow strength increases damage/velocity. The increase in velocity makes the arrows easier to hit and reach farther. It would be possible to tone down/remove bow strength and the arrows would fly like vanilla.

 

[CoolBeans279]

Its rouge balancing time, so buuuuuuump!

@Balance Team