Suggestion My suggestion on patches to classes

[TheMechaHeavy]

Suggestion on balancing classes out.​

First off, if you disagree don't be hostile in your response, simply reply.

Gonna start off with Casters:

Pyromancer - I don't think they need 90 hatchet damage at level 60, keep in mind that is almost more than samurai at level 60. I also don't see the need for them to have kick. They already have very powerful caster skills such as fireblast and chaosorb. I really don't see why they have to shut down every other caster even more, especially wizard.

Wizard - I know everyone has been calling wizard op lately and I will not disagree. They're cooldown on bolt is ridiculously short. Ten seconds? I think that might be a little low. Other than that I think they are balaced, considering they can can 4 hit by a ninja/samurai.

Necromancer - Their DoT damage is amazing, that's why you play necro, right? Well I suggest a nerf on the range of poison. I also think the cooldown on it should be decreased considering it stacks with both decay and plague at the same time, causing massive damage towards caster classes per tick.

Beguiler - I'm going to make this plain and simple, take some time off piggify/mass piggify, it seems like forever in combat. I think it should decrease plague bomb damage slightly the more targets it hits.

Warriors:

Paladin - Why did we give paladin reckoning again? It was the one thing they needed to be extremely overpowered. I don't think the class needs a cc/forcepull, they have divine stun already. My suggestion, either scrap divine stun and increase CD on reckoning, or scrap reckoning all-together.

Dreadknight - I don't have a problem with dreadknight except empathy. It literally drops my health even as a warrior. People will defend that it takes 50 hp but honestly that is barely anything when it comes to having 1k health. Harmtouch and take some damage, empathy...GG.

Dragoon - Most annoying class on the server. Superjump CD way too short. I cannot stress that enough. People might say "It takes half of your stamina." Who cares? you superjump somewhere nobody can get you and camp up there until stamina recharges and health recharges. Even if you miss the first superjump you've still got more than half stamina to cast another, you can easily tank the damage in the 10 second interval.

Samurai - Escape artist is not needed as a samurai, they already have windwalk which is enough to catch up on lost ground from snares/slows. I think they need to decrease damage slightly on each hit.

Rogue:

Ninja - Needs a buff if you ask me. Either it's not doing enough damage or everyone else out damages them. I can't think of anything to add to them so somebody help me out with that.

Ranger - Seems fine to me, although I am a little bummed out they lost arrowstorm I think they might need a little more armor penetration so they can fight tanks like DK and paladins.

Runeblade - I don't know anything about this class but I do know they don't do enough damage. Could use some suggestions from others.

Bard - Love the class, it's fun to play and the only think I dislike about them is that they can have speed 3 for almost ever. Unless you have a necro or someone with a long DoT, there is no way to catch them.

Healer:

Cleric - Nerf self heals, I think that is already happening to all healers though. It can easily "kite and smite" and kill samurais even though it is a support healer.

Mystic - Nerf mana regeneration like crazy, keep replenish but make heals cost more mana and decrease a little more on self.

Bloodmage - Balanced if you ask me, I like the class and it has skills that make sense to me.

Disciple - The lag ruins this class, I was skirmish a disciple, he force pushed luckily, it did nothing and i got "rubber-banded" back to my original spot.

Once again, you don't have to shut down my ideas even if you disagree.

 

[Dsawemd]

commenting on what I know/think.

1. Im not sure that every class needs a change, but I AM sure that this many changes can not be implemented at once, we will not have a clear idea of what pvp would look like if all classes were changed.

2. Beguiler - AoEs through walls need to either lose some of their effect, or Plaguebomb needs to do less damage per additional target after 4(ish) targets. I think Piggify/mass piggify is ok atm.

3. Paladin - They could lose Reckoning and gain some sort of weak Root, it would be less overpowered.

3. Samurai - Either I need to understand speed boosts and how to combat them better, or Windwalk should reduce their swords damage for the duration by 10. I swear they get in so MANY extra hits...

4. Ninja - I do not see needing a "buff" use more specific language.

5. Ranger - 2 problems atm, FireArrow causes [periods of zero arrow damage while target is on fire, and IceArrow is way too important to the rotation, to the point that Rangers do not use any other skill than IceArrow for many opponents. I have suggested to replace FireArrow with another armor ignoring ticks for a total of 49 dmg (same as firearrow minus the fire part), and I would increase the mana cost of IceArrow.

6. Bard - I know disc 11 bonus damage got removed, but I still think that Bards are hitting hard for a class that can support so much.

7. Cleric - I do not know how to fix it, but Cleric has too much solo and group survivability, make them choose one, maybe make Might apply only to allies, not the Cleric themself.

8. Disciple - Recently (Jan 1) Disciple got a huge improvement to their ability to throw you around. Check again, their forcepush is devastating in world PvP with any kind of elevation. I do not see this as a problem, since damage was not increased along with throwing ability, and since Disciples are so squishy.

 

[TheMechaHeavy]

commenting on what I know/think.

1. Im not sure that every class needs a change, but I AM sure that this many changes can not be implemented at once, we will not have a clear idea of what pvp would look like if all classes were changed.

2. Beguiler - AoEs through walls need to either lose some of their effect, or Plaguebomb needs to do less damage per additional target after 4(ish) targets. I think Piggify/mass piggify is ok atm.

3. Paladin - They could lose Reckoning and gain some sort of weak Root, it would be less overpowered.

3. Samurai - Either I need to understand speed boosts and how to combat them better, or Windwalk should reduce their swords damage for the duration by 10. I swear they get in so MANY extra hits...

4. Ninja - I do not see needing a "buff" use more specific language.

5. Ranger - 2 problems atm, FireArrow causes [periods of zero arrow damage while target is on fire, and IceArrow is way too important to the rotation, to the point that Rangers do not use any other skill than IceArrow for many opponents. I have suggested to replace FireArrow with another armor ignoring ticks for a total of 49 dmg (same as firearrow minus the fire part), and I would increase the mana cost of IceArrow.

6. Bard - I know disc 11 bonus damage got removed, but I still think that Bards are hitting hard for a class that can support so much.

7. Cleric - I do not know how to fix it, but Cleric has too much solo and group survivability, make them choose one, maybe make Might apply only to allies, not the Cleric themself.

8. Disciple - Recently (Jan 1) Disciple got a huge improvement to their ability to throw you around. Check again, their forcepush is devastating in world PvP with any kind of elevation. I do not see this as a problem, since damage was not increased along with throwing ability, and since Disciples are so squishy.

Well, I wasn't saying you HAD to implement all the changes. These are just my personal opinions on how the classes would be balanced in comparison to the other classes. Of course if you implemented all of these it would still have op and not so op classes. Also, I never said disciple was weak, I was just pointing out that their forcepush/pull is useless when I get rubberbanded back to the spot he pushed me. If there was less lag the skills could reach their full potential. I have read you fire arrow post already, it's been happening forever, if it is possible for them to fix it, please do I might be switching back to ranger in the near future.

 

[Templar_James]

Suggestion on balancing classes out.​

First off, if you disagree don't be hostile in your response, simply reply.

Gonna start off with Casters:

Pyromancer - I don't think they need 90 hatchet damage at level 60, keep in mind that is almost more than samurai at level 60. I also don't see the need for them to have kick. They already have very powerful caster skills such as fireblast and chaosorb. I really don't see why they have to shut down every other caster even more, especially wizard.

Wizard - I know everyone has been calling wizard op lately and I will not disagree. They're cooldown on bolt is ridiculously short. Ten seconds? I think that might be a little low. Other than that I think they are balaced, considering they can can 4 hit by a ninja/samurai.

Necromancer - Their DoT damage is amazing, that's why you play necro, right? Well I suggest a nerf on the range of poison. I also think the cooldown on it should be decreased considering it stacks with both decay and plague at the same time, causing massive damage towards caster classes per tick.

Beguiler - I'm going to make this plain and simple, take some time off piggify/mass piggify, it seems like forever in combat. I think it should decrease plague bomb damage slightly the more targets it hits.

Warriors:

Paladin - Why did we give paladin reckoning again? It was the one thing they needed to be extremely overpowered. I don't think the class needs a cc/forcepull, they have divine stun already. My suggestion, either scrap divine stun and increase CD on reckoning, or scrap reckoning all-together.

Dreadknight - I don't have a problem with dreadknight except empathy. It literally drops my health even as a warrior. People will defend that it takes 50 hp but honestly that is barely anything when it comes to having 1k health. Harmtouch and take some damage, empathy...GG.

Dragoon - Most annoying class on the server. Superjump CD way too short. I cannot stress that enough. People might say "It takes half of your stamina." Who cares? you superjump somewhere nobody can get you and camp up there until stamina recharges and health recharges. Even if you miss the first superjump you've still got more than half stamina to cast another, you can easily tank the damage in the 10 second interval.

Samurai - Escape artist is not needed as a samurai, they already have windwalk which is enough to catch up on lost ground from snares/slows. I think they need to decrease damage slightly on each hit.

Rogue:

Ninja - Needs a buff if you ask me. Either it's not doing enough damage or everyone else out damages them. I can't think of anything to add to them so somebody help me out with that.

Ranger - Seems fine to me, although I am a little bummed out they lost arrowstorm I think they might need a little more armor penetration so they can fight tanks like DK and paladins.

Runeblade - I don't know anything about this class but I do know they don't do enough damage. Could use some suggestions from others.

Bard - Love the class, it's fun to play and the only think I dislike about them is that they can have speed 3 for almost ever. Unless you have a necro or someone with a long DoT, there is no way to catch them.

Healer:

Cleric - Nerf self heals, I think that is already happening to all healers though. It can easily "kite and smite" and kill samurais even though it is a support healer.

Mystic - Nerf mana regeneration like crazy, keep replenish but make heals cost more mana and decrease a little more on self.

Bloodmage - Balanced if you ask me, I like the class and it has skills that make sense to me.

Disciple - The lag ruins this class, I was skirmish a disciple, he force pushed luckily, it did nothing and i got "rubber-banded" back to my original spot.

Once again, you don't have to shut down my ideas even if you disagree.

I am a dragoon and I am defending myself but superjump and jump are the only moves when can actually use that are good... Impale is shit because it does no damage and kids can still try to sprint and slightly stay out of hit range. Spear does crap because of rubber band. And tremor barely does anything cause no one is stupid enough to follow you up a hill all we have is either bash or strike...

 

[STDs4YouAnd4Me]

I'll only be commenting on classes I have mastered thus far.

Ninja - Needs a buff if you ask me. Either it's not doing enough damage or everyone else out damages them. I can't think of anything to add to them so somebody help me out with that.

Ninja doesn't need a buff... it does PLENTY of damage. If there's one thing a Ninja doesn't need, it's their bolt ability. With a 1 second cast time, you can do more damage with your sword in that same timeframe, so it is relatively useless.

Cleric - Nerf self heals, I think that is already happening to all healers though. It can easily "kite and smite" and kill samurais even though it is a support healer.

All healers have had their self heals nerfed by 33%, so good luck asking for that to be done again. Cleric's Ampul is awful, and needs to be replaced with a legit secondary party heal. I also found that Clerics run out of mana very quickly. You need to decide whether or not to use smite in your team fight or not. If you use it, you'll run out of mana fairly quickly and won't be able to heal yourself... if you don't use it, you'll be dealing low hoe damage all game.

Mystic - Nerf mana regeneration like crazy, keep replenish but make heals cost more mana and decrease a little more on self.

Mystic just got nerfed 2 weeks ago. Higher mana costs and longer cooldowns. If you're asking for this to be done AGAIN, then like I said, good luck above, good luck.

Bloodmage - Balanced if you ask me, I like the class and it has skills that make sense to me.

I played bloodmage for a week and loved it. I never saw myself coming close to running out of mana, so I'm not sure if they changed that aspect yet.

Disciple - The lag ruins this class, I was skirmish a disciple, he force pushed luckily, it did nothing and i got "rubber-banded" back to my original spot.

Disciple is the funnest class to play as a Healer, and perhaps the funnest on the server. Unfortunately, like you said, the skills only work a small portion of the time. Here's a fun question : What do you get when you try to forcepush ANY melee class but it rubberbands them right back to your face? The answer is, of course, instant death. It's a real bummer when I 'outplay' my opponents in a skirmish for 90% of the fight, but 1 wrong move (due to the rubber banding issue) makes me go from 10 hearts to 0 hearts in 5 seconds flat.

 

[TheMechaHeavy]

I am a dragoon and I am defending myself but superjump and jump are the only moves when can actually use that are good... Impale is shit because it does no damage and kids can still try to sprint and slightly stay out of hit range. Spear does crap because of rubber band. And tremor barely does anything cause no one is stupid enough to follow you up a hill all we have is either bash or strike...

Well, lag affects every class no doubt. You should really start using spear and tremor they are very good skills if you know how to use them. You don't need to superjump every 10 seconds, it makes you impossible to catch. Jump is already easy to get away with i'm not suggesting you nerf that. On top of that, your DPS your skills should aid you in fighting, like disarm, bash, cleave.... they shouldn't be your source of damage. I really don't know what you mean by "impale is shit" your going to have to specify more if you want me to understand what your gettng at.

 

[Aundora]

Agree with the suggestion on Ranger... I get wrecked by anything that can wear something better than chainmail so I would appreciate that a lot =D

 

[TheMechaHeavy]

I'll only be commenting on classes I have mastered thus far.



Ninja doesn't need a buff... it does PLENTY of damage. If there's one thing a Ninja doesn't need, it's their bolt ability. With a 1 second cast time, you can do more damage with your sword in that same timeframe, so it is relatively useless.



All healers have had their self heals nerfed by 33%, so good luck asking for that to be done again. Cleric's Ampul is awful, and needs to be replaced with a legit secondary party heal. I also found that Clerics run out of mana very quickly. You need to decide whether or not to use smite in your team fight or not. If you use it, you'll run out of mana fairly quickly and won't be able to heal yourself... if you don't use it, you'll be dealing low hoe damage all game.



Mystic just got nerfed 2 weeks ago. Higher mana costs and longer cooldowns. If you're asking for this to be done AGAIN, then like I said, good luck above, good luck.




I played bloodmage for a week and loved it. I never saw myself coming close to running out of mana, so I'm not sure if they changed that aspect yet.



Disciple is the funnest class to play as a Healer, and perhaps the funnest on the server. Unfortunately, like you said, the skills only work a small portion of the time. Here's a fun question : What do you get when you try to forcepush ANY melee class but it rubberbands them right back to your face? The answer is, of course, instant death. It's a real bummer when I 'outplay' my opponents in a skirmish for 90% of the fight, but 1 wrong move (due to the rubber banding issue) makes me go from 10 hearts to 0 hearts in 5 seconds flat.

I'm not saying nerf self heals again I was 100% sure if it happened already so I included that. I didn't talk about ampul because I know its awful, but still, their heals are insanely useful when used on them selves. I've fought many clerics and I don't think it's very fair that they can kill people even though they were created as a support class. I would also say the same for bard, they dish out pretty good damage for the support class they are.

 

[TheMechaHeavy]

I am a dragoon and I am defending myself but superjump and jump are the only moves when can actually use that are good... Impale is shit because it does no damage and kids can still try to sprint and slightly stay out of hit range. Spear does crap because of rubber band. And tremor barely does anything cause no one is stupid enough to follow you up a hill all we have is either bash or strike...

I've also noticed the only skills you use are jump, superjump and bash/cleave. I would highly suggest keybinds.

 

[LightningCape]

Bloodmage - Balanced if you ask me, I like the class and it has skills that make sense to me.

Finally someone else says its a balanced class.

​

Beguiler - I'm going to make this plain and simple, take some time off piggify/mass piggify, it seems like forever in combat. I think it should decrease plague bomb damage slightly the more targets it hits.

.

Would kind of kill beguiler.

​

Ninja - Needs a buff if you ask me. Either it's not doing enough damage or everyone else out damages them. I can't think of anything to add to them so somebody help me out with that.

Lol Ninja doesn't do enough damage? It has the highest damage for a diamond sword in the entire server.

​

Mystic - Nerf mana regeneration like crazy, keep replenish but make heals cost more mana and decrease a little more on self.

Would make Mystic the most least played class on the server was already nerf multiple times.




While some of these suggestions are practice and good I feel some of them are more opinion based than others like your ones for Ninja and Mystic.

 

[Faunherer]

All the suggestions of his are based on opinion.

 

[Templar_James]

I've also noticed the only skills you use are jump, superjump and bash/cleave. I would highly suggest keybinds.

Ugh like I said spear has the rubber band effect that's why I never use it. impale doesn't do the damage it's suppose to because it doesn't do any damage at all and people can still kite with impale on them. All the dragoons I know barely ever use impale unless they just got the skill and are testing it in pvp. Tremor also has the rubber effect but people are also not stupid enough to follow you ontop of a mountain -.- . Adding a bigger timer on superjump I don't mind because it is kind of short maybe 15-20 seconds.

 

[Fjordsen]

I agree with most of the suggestions except the ninja one, ninjas dish out insane amount of damage. One blackjack on any caster spec, GG.

 

[Kwong050]

Yea the ninja one is just completely wrong and the dragoon one is also wrong. Dragoons are fine as they are but might need a lil more dmg.

 

[Kainzo]

Read this for how to make a valid suggestion/balance thread
http://www.herocraftonline.com/main/threads/stop-using-subjective-terms-op-up-nerfed.25237/

 

[northeaster345]

-deleted

I thought bolt was 15 seconds, it is 10, I think it would make sense to increase the cd to 15 seconds

 

[leftovers5]

I like some of these suggestions, others not so much.

Again, this is subjective, but classes that I see that are fine currently/don't need to be changed (and thus, I won't be commenting on):
Necromancer, Dragoon, Samurai, Ninja, Ranger, Bard, Mystic, Bloodmage, and Disciple.

As far as your suggested changes and my commentary:

Pyromancer - I would agree on pushing the axe damage much lower and having the class more focused on skills. When I think of fire, I think of short burst damage that will quickly rid the enemy. Chopping away (literally) with an axe should not be the main source of damage for pyros, and at times it can be.

Wizard - While probably the most balanced class throughout Zeal/DragonGuarde and early Bastion, some of its cooldowns are a bit short currently for the status of PvP. As a glass cannon, it fits its role well, but I could see a three to five second increase on bolt.

Beguiler - If done well, this is arguably one of the best classes on the server with kiting. I always sort of wanted the plaguebomb to do smaller self-damage if it explodes nearby you as well, as it is a very strong skill.

Paladin - I know they're meant to be the ultimate masters of defense, but at this point it's so extreme that people CRINGE when they see paladins. They're not fun to fight, even with massive crowd control/slows, they can still outrun enemies with significant health left. I could see them getting a health decrease and a decrease on all self heals.

Dreadknight - This has turned into a high damage, high defense class. It's the ultimate juggernaut, and that seems like the wrong place for this class. I'd rather see it doing less damage with empathy and axe damage, if it were to maintain the defense it currently has.

Runeblade - I hate to say it, but this class is overboard right now. It's deadly, but people don't seem to realize it. Firewave is a constant problem still, and I know macura agrees, but coupled with duskblade it is far too dangerous a foe to reckon with.

Cleric - Self heals really need to be fixed. Hoe damage may be low, but fighting with a cleric is a war of attrition, one that you would most certainly use. I am for removing the iron chest and replacing it with chain.
Mystic - Replenish is still a bit silly right now, and I don't really need to

 

[Goonswarm]

Wizards are a spec that scale with skill, and the issue is that you are fighting good Wizards. The class is extremely well balanced and I am required to get into very close range to bolt my target, while staying in that range. I also die to nearly anything hitting me.

I don't feel any Wizard changes are needed, but I do agree with the Pyromancer axe damage

 

[arcanegrove]

I like some of these suggestions, others not so much.

*Snip*
Pyromancer - I would agree on pushing the axe damage much lower and having the class more focused on skills. When I think of fire, I think of short burst damage that will quickly rid the enemy. Chopping away (literally) with an axe should not be the main source of damage for pyros, and at times it can be.

Actually, while i was a lower level pyro, I hardly EVER used my axe in skirmishes. All I do is kite and withering/fireblast fireball. I would rather give them HIGHER(Not much, if any) axe damage, a little more armor and take away a few skills. A pyro against any rogue or warrior, get even CLOSE to near and you're dead (Except Rangers, they be squishy). Make them a little more reliant on axe damage. As they are right now, there basicly wizards last last map. I can run out of a GY and dish out 500 damage without any wepons.