Suggestion My biggest frustrations on PvP; ways to balance and make more enjoyable

[Ultanian]

@CoolBeans279
@JupiterRome because I know you two are going to flame and hate anyways.

Let's put a scenario on the board here; I'm working on my town. Minding my own business, and all of the sudden a wild pack of raiders appear. Chaos ensues, and due to it being a 3v1 (or most often, level 65s vs 30 and below) I die within seconds. With messages like "get rekt nub" and "git gud" and dying, already I'm in a bad mood. I just lost some exp, tools essential for building myself up, and possibly a ton of blocks or reagents.

Now, I either have to face this group on my own, recall to a safe place, or just wait for the guys to leave. Option numbers 2 and 3 are often the only viable way, and it can take a very long time to do so.

If I were to face them, I'm still at a disadvantage. As a caster, let's say Wizard, I wouldn't be able to fight normally due to the lack of reagents. As a healer, not enough damage is available. In this situation, Warriors and Rogues have the game in their favor. Armor and most often weapons are kept when playing as these.

And here comes the list of suggestions:

• Upon dying, receive a PvP invuln that expires upon doing damage or within 2 minutes.
• All items are kept on death.
• Players who have a difference of 20 levels or more cannot PvP eachother, unless they both agree using a specifc command.
• Dying too often results in items dropping. (5 times per hour)
• Killing a player gives you some of his or her souls; let's say 10?

Before you "PvPers" disagree and f-palm, please explain why and list the positive and negatives to back up your opinion. All of the above suggestions are used in many RPG games, so they are worthy of implementing.

 

[Trazil]

It's a PVP server, you take risks being on it. I don't understand after PVE was created people still complain about PVP.

Zero items kept on death.
No PVP invuln unless they can't get their death chest.
No to the 20 lvls thing, I like pvping as soon I get 1or 2 of my good skills, so for necro that's like lvl 20-25.
Items should all drop. All the time.
Taking souls away when you die in PVP will increase camping and give people more stuff to complain about.

Those are the reasons for the f-Palm.

I don't really think you understand that you can recall and get reagents to fight back, and healers are in no disadvantage. A healer can sustain itself long enough for its dmging skills to kill their opponent. Warriors and rogues do have an advantage with the current system but that's another reason all items should drop, and it gives more loot for PVP.

@UltNachopony

 

[JupiterRome]

I just disagree with this, 2 macs tracked me and I killed them as a lvl 12 dk so idk what you mean by level thing especially with casters
Like I PvP as a level 20
I also think PvP immunity leads to abusing it to get drops

All items kept on death? That makes it really un-rewarding for any kills
So I'm going to leave a disagree

 

[Ultanian]

It's a PVP server, you take risks being on it. I don't understand after PVE was created people still complain about PVP.

Zero items kept on death.
No PVP invuln unless they can't get their death chest.
No to the 20 lvls thing, I like pvping as soon I get 1or 2 of my good skills, so for necro that's like lvl 20-25.
Items should all drop. All the time.
Taking souls away when you die in PVP will increase camping and give people more stuff to complain about.

Those are the reasons for the f-Palm.

I don't really think you understand that you can recall and get reagents to fight back, and healers are in no disadvantage. A healer can sustain itself long enough for its dmging skills to kill their opponent. Warriors and rogues do have an advantage with the current system but that's another reason all items should drop, and it gives more loot for PVP.

@UltNachopony

20 level DIFFERENCE. A player whos 20 levels below another shouldn't have to fight him.

 

[Ultanian]

I just disagree with this, 2 macs tracked me and I killed them as a lvl 12 dk so idk what you mean by level thing especially with casters
Like I PvP as a level 20
I also think PvP immunity leads to abusing it to get drops

All items kept on death? That makes it really un-rewarding for any kills
So I'm going to leave a disagree

You get souls instead of items from killing people. There's still a benefit.

 

[JupiterRome]

You get souls instead of items from killing people. There's still a benefit.

Forgot about that, sorry, 10 is really in rewarding and I like it better this way because I can gank someone and get nothing or I can gank someone moving and get 1k

 

[Carbash]

I dont see why everyone is against a hardcore pvp system. Its what made this server. Getting mad at people for wanting it to be that way does not make sense. I suck at pvp, but i grew to love the chaos that was herocraft. Now that view is getting skewed and distorted and killing off what was once a great server. Who cares if you get camped, i mean really... Make some friends and get those fuckers back. Trust me when you finally get good enough to kill them before they kill you, it is really satisfying.

 

[MalaWolf]

Tldr; this is Herocraft, not carebearcraft

• All items are kept on death

Herocraft is an rpg-survival server in which you compete against rival players and team up with allies. If you didn't lose items on death what is the point of raiding? While there are elements of fun in pvp, the original and primary reason to pvp was to get items. Furthermore it removes the risk factor for keeping stuff safe, as a Paladin I can use a god sword, God sheild and pickaxe and not have to worry about losing anything, as a raider I can stay in your base longer because I don't lose all reagents and food when I die, and you do not have this risk of losing anything when you are mining, or wandering around the map. This is an rpg-survival/pvp server, there needs to be consequences for dying, and reward for pvp.

• Players with a difference of 20 levels cannot pvp against each other

While I agree that there are some issues with lost soul and higher levels, once you are specced you should be fair game. We as balance are trying to minimise the level severity, but it's wrong to say you will only win if you are a higher level, and herocraft is not rock paper doctors, there is a definite skill difference that allows good players regardless of levels to win fights. Furthermore players attacking lower levels is a fundamental trait of herocraft, while it may not be enjoyable ever player has experienced this, I know I have even at the start of this map being camped by Freepers and Umbra as a citizen of Aria. Players should be forming groups to repel invaders or make a town with the new (strong) defenses. Just because you don't like pvp how it is, does not mean it's wrong. This is herocraft not carebearcraft.

• Killing a player steals 10-15s

This point confuses me, your initial posts are how camping is bad and measures should be taken to prevent this, but then you suggest something that will not only encourage, but reward camping. If I was able to steal money and 10-15 is a very successive amount, I would keep doing this because for me this is a win win, money in the bank and less money for you to spend on town defenses. This would also encourage people to kill new players for the money they start off with, driving players from the server.

Overall in my opinion, these ideas are not well thought out, and help create a carebear server that contrasts the ideals of rpg-survival/pvp. if you are being constantly camped I suggest making a town and using the defenses in there before asking for suggestions that diminish pvp and have absolutely no counter-play and finally, If you do not want to pvp at this time there is a perfectly valid pve server.

 

[MunchlaxHero]

I dont see why everyone is against a hardcore pvp system. Its what made this server. Getting mad at people for wanting it to be that way does not make sense. I suck at pvp, but i grew to love the chaos that was herocraft. Now that view is getting skewed and distorted and killing off what was once a great server. Who cares if you get camped, i mean really... Make some friends and get those fuckers back. Trust me when you finally get good enough to kill them before they kill you, it is really satisfying.

Silly carbash hc isn't a hardcore server. It's not like we lose all items upon deaths, it's not like PvP server was the only option it's not like the only safe zones are spawn and gys it's not like towns have no op defenses. No this isn't a hardcore server. This is a server for noobs. Did I fucking quit when spikesLoL hunted me down time after time when I first joined and took all my good? Fuck no I swore to get revenge and eventually I got good at pvp and enjoyed killing Umbra. But now it's all gone.It started with the items kept on death and ends with townships 3.0

 

[MCderpy12]

Silly carbash hc isn't a hardcore server. It's not like we lose all items upon deaths, it's not like PvP server was the only option it's not like the only safe zones are spawn and gys it's not like towns have no op defenses. No this isn't a hardcore server. This is a server for noobs. Did I fucking quit when spikesLoL hunted me down time after time when I first joined and took all my good? Fuck no I swore to get revenge and eventually I got good at pvp and enjoyed killing Umbra. But now it's all gone.It started with the items kept on death and ends with townships 3.0

Such anger....

I agree with the 2min unvun, but however this may be abused

Nuff said?

 

[w0nd3rb0y]

Silly carbash hc isn't a hardcore server. It's not like we lose all items upon deaths, it's not like PvP server was the only option it's not like the only safe zones are spawn and gys it's not like towns have no op defenses. No this isn't a hardcore server. This is a server for noobs. Did I fucking quit when spikesLoL hunted me down time after time when I first joined and took all my good? Fuck no I swore to get revenge and eventually I got good at pvp and enjoyed killing Umbra. But now it's all gone.It started with the items kept on death and ends with townships 3.0

I had a similar experience in the beginning. I was killed time and time again by Legacy and TC. Did I quit? No. I eventually became core members of each group. Where we dominated PvP for a long time. I don't understand why people complain so much. I too hate camping, and don't typically do it myself. I may camp a DeathChest here and there. But I get my kills and move on. Here's how I solve camping. Learn the politics of the server. When a person/persons camp you, message another group who is openly against the campers, and asked them to help you.

 

[Trazil]

@UltNachopony i know what you meant about the 20 lvl difference, but pvp max people as soon as i get to around 20 necro.

I remember Bastion when freepers camped Altum where jupiter lived. that was a very fun time even though a noob let them in and they burned all of his stuff. It always gave me someone to fight and made me more cautious of what i did. It was probably my favorite time on Herocraft.

 

[Xhazed]

Hahahahah just hahahahahahhahahahahhahahahahahthanks goodby

 

[JupiterRome]

Silly carbash hc isn't a hardcore server. It's not like we lose all items upon deaths, it's not like PvP server was the only option it's not like the only safe zones are spawn and gys it's not like towns have no op defenses. No this isn't a hardcore server. This is a server for noobs. Did I fucking quit when spikesLoL hunted me down time after time when I first joined and took all my good? Fuck no I swore to get revenge and eventually I got good at pvp and enjoyed killing Umbra. But now it's all gone.It started with the items kept on death and ends with townships 3.0

Lol you got good at pvp?

 

[JupiterRome]

I had a similar experience in the beginning. I was killed time and time again by Legacy and TC. Did I quit? No. I eventually became core members of each group. Where we dominated PvP for a long time. I don't understand why people complain so much. I too hate camping, and don't typically do it myself. I may camp a DeathChest here and there. But I get my kills and move on. Here's how I solve camping. Learn the politics of the server. When a person/persons camp you, message another group who is openly against the campers, and asked them to help you.

I remember the answer to freepers camping me was
/msg glob /msg realmatt (ANy Umbra Basically, Then there was a teamfight for me to watch)

 

[JupiterRome]

BTW Freepers got into my house and burned everything I own while I watched..... I didn't quit

 

[malikdanab]

BTW Freepers got into my house and burned everything I own while I watched..... I didn't quit

Not everyone is as determined/stubborn as you Jup

 

[Trazil]

Not everyone is as determined/stubborn as you Jup

He isn't determined, he was just too lazy to find another server

 

[MunchlaxHero]

Not everyone is as determined/stubborn as you Jup

Sadly thats why pve exists and that's why hc isn't hardcore anymore

 

[PewPewPewLasers]

I disagree with the post for the reasons malawolf/trazil listed, but gave a facepalm because you said "PvPers" instead of PvPers. This right here shows that you cater to the PvE side of the PvP map. These changes are for you specifically, not for anyone else. Just because they are in other games, in no way does that mean they should be in Herocraft.