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Suggestion Item Restoration Policy missing/neglected

Should we update the Rules/Policies of the server to protect CHEST GRIEFING in towns?


  • Total voters
    49

Northac

Obsidian
Joined
Jul 31, 2012
What the real issue here isnt policy, the real issue is that Mayors aren't given the proper tools to defend themselves against malicious intent.

We need sub-regions, mayor-only LWC's (or donation LWC's) and things like it. I feel like instead of changing policy to help against this type of thing, we should instead make sure it can't or is very unlikely to happen.

I could also see the LWC limit increasing across the board.

While i have never had this issue happen to me, after reading through this id have to go with Kainzo on this, is the leaders of the town are given a second set of LWCs that only work for them (only if they hold the rank) they would be able protect the towns storage, and be able to add players as needed to individual chests like personal locked chests.

There are a few issuses that need looking at
*possible limit on number of chests
*how to assign them to town mayors for town use only
*preventing the above mentioned leaders from useing the towns lwcs fro personal use

there are probably a few i am not thinking of, but these are the big ones i think. A town set of lwcs would be easier to manage than a sub-region (or at least i think).
This would make it the mayors/leaders responsibility to look carefully at all the wish to give premissions to, it may not prevent all incidents it would cut down on them and these new players that join for the purpose of screwing with a town would not be able to do much.

Though i do agree that the punishment for these players should be harsh, swift and sevre.

On an off note, I am again impressed how we can civily discuss things like this as a community, even with so many different opinions.
 

xexorian

Admin ZeeZo
Retired Staff
Joined
Apr 7, 2011
Location
USA
While i have never had this issue happen to me, after reading through this id have to go with Kainzo on this, is the leaders of the town are given a second set of LWCs that only work for them (only if they hold the rank) they would be able protect the towns storage, and be able to add players as needed to individual chests like personal locked chests.

There are a few issuses that need looking at
*possible limit on number of chests
*how to assign them to town mayors for town use only
*preventing the above mentioned leaders from useing the towns lwcs fro personal use

there are probably a few i am not thinking of, but these are the big ones i think. A town set of lwcs would be easier to manage than a sub-region (or at least i think).
This would make it the mayors/leaders responsibility to look carefully at all the wish to give premissions to, it may not prevent all incidents it would cut down on them and these new players that join for the purpose of screwing with a town would not be able to do much.

Though i do agree that the punishment for these players should be harsh, swift and sevre.

On an off note, I am again impressed how we can civily discuss things like this as a community, even with so many different opinions.

I like your post but I disagree with part of it -- child regions specifically. Those are really easy to handle. All you need is a world edit wand and make a cuboid selection within your town's chunk's. You basically add plots as a sub-region and label it. plot1, plot2, plot3, gatenorth, gatesouth, etc. so, basically how it works is that players added to only those child regions can build/destroy in that child region, this would have a few major effects:

1) citizens build rights could easily be managed to only where they're supposed to build.
2) vaults for townships wouldn't need LWC's (but as a bonus, mayors could get MAYOR-ONLY lwc's for use for the town, as we did before)
3) citizens couldn't grief anything outside of the gates to get into a town, and their plot.

If everything was covered then they'd be fine. The whole town would be raidable, but as long as the citizens kept their doors locked, and things covered or lwc'd by a mayor then towns could be used for storage again... and not personal regions.

The issue is that towns used to get around 100-200 LWC's, which was more than enough back in the day. I'd also like to point out that maps were reset more often so people had less time to acquire massive amounts of items to build with.

If you think about storing a double chest of every block and item, that's quite a few double chests. Most people aren't going to LWC farmed goods, they're going to LWC one chest filled with each farmed good, and then save the rest for iron ores for transmuting, coal and coal blocks, redstone and redstone blocks, have cut down on their storage amount, iron and iron blocks, lapis and lapis blocks, i mean, all of this stuff has an item and block, and are used for different things.

At best, I hope we would get Mayor's get mayor-only LWC's that represent the size and type of town they're in charge of.

Hamlet's get 50 LWC's
Town's get 100 LWC's
City's get 150 LWC's
Capital's get 200 LWC's
Kingdom's get 200 LWC's

This means if you had a Kingdom and one of each town you'd have around 700 LWC's possible. That's enough to protect about 100 people's shit. That's about how many we have in our Kingdom currently, even with dwindling numbers. If we recruited a bunch Those numbers could triple but people don't stay active, so it would just be good township/kingdom management to maintain your LWC limitations. This would also give some incentive for Mayors to want to upgrade their towns and keep them well managed.
 

Barnubus

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Jul 18, 2011
Location
California
Would this be a mayor only thing, or could managers also be able to help in this area.
My town's mayor is inactive yet refuses to hand over mayorship, so I am now running the town as a manager only. I understand my case isn't normal, but I was just wondering, mayors only, correct?
 

Eldrylars

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Apr 28, 2012
Location
Dragon through ...
Would this be a mayor only thing, or could managers also be able to help in this area.
My town's mayor is inactive yet refuses to hand over mayorship, so I am now running the town as a manager only. I understand my case isn't normal, but I was just wondering, mayors only, correct?

No, your case is pretty normal :rolleyes:

I like your post but I disagree with part of it -- child regions specifically. Those are really easy to handle. All you need is a world edit wand and make a cuboid selection within your town's chunk's. You basically add plots as a sub-region and label it. plot1, plot2, plot3, gatenorth, gatesouth, etc. so, basically how it works is that players added to only those child regions can build/destroy in that child region, this would have a few major effects:

Unfortunately it's not this easy because townships do not use world guard. They are a different tailored plugin called Herotowns. Herotowns is not programmed for sub regions so there is no way to create the sub regions that we are talking about. Otherwise what you are listing requires either giving town mayors full world guard rights, which could easily be abused anywhere in the game world, or admins would have to manually mark the regions for the Mayor which would take hours and hours and hours. Until someone can recode Herotowns it's just not easily possible.
 

Bedwyr2112

Legacy Supporter 9
Joined
Oct 3, 2012
It would be great to have chests that belong to the town or kingdom. If you compare to a lot of main steam MMORPG's, they provide the ability to have a central bank for a guild or clan where permissions can be set on who has access. This is essentially the same thing we need here.

If LWC's could be issued to towns and kingdoms and managed by the Mayor's and managers or a custom list of trusted members, I think it would go along way to give the towns the security they want.

Support for sub regions for kingdoms and towns would be great, but in my opinion I think that more control over LWC's and having allocations to kingdoms/towns would be more valuable.

At best, I hope we would get Mayor's get mayor-only LWC's that represent the size and type of town they're in charge of.

Hamlet's get 50 LWC's
Town's get 100 LWC's
City's get 150 LWC's
Capital's get 200 LWC's
Kingdom's get 200 LWC's

I like the idea of having different allocations of LWC's based on town size. I know it would be nice to have LWC's specifically for Kingdoms as it allows you to protect materials required for Kingdom Taxes and would allow for Donation chests to be safely managed without the need to use personal LWC's for this purpose.
 

Carbash

Legacy Supporter 6
Joined
Sep 17, 2012
Unfortunately it's not this easy because townships do not use world guard. They are a different tailored plugin called Herotowns. Herotowns is not programmed for sub regions so there is no way to create the sub regions that we are talking about. Otherwise what you are listing requires either giving town mayors full world guard rights, which could easily be abused anywhere in the game world, or admins would have to manually mark the regions for the Mayor which would take hours and hours and hours. Until someone can recode Herotowns it's just not easily possible.

If you made town vaults with world guard within a township it would require less time from the admins, also these vaults wouldn't need lwcs at all. Give permissions to the mayor (and anyone else who you wish access) for just that region within the township. Give them a set size and cost a decent amount of coin. This is all under the assumption that world guard takes priority over herotowns (not sure). Have mayors place a pe to add or remove anyone from their town vault.

Not entirely sure if it would work but may be an option if it does.
 

Kainzo

The Disposable Hero
Staff member
Founder
Adventure Team
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Location
The 7th Circle of Heaven
No, your case is pretty normal :rolleyes:



Unfortunately it's not this easy because townships do not use world guard. They are a different tailored plugin called Herotowns. Herotowns is not programmed for sub regions so there is no way to create the sub regions that we are talking about. Otherwise what you are listing requires either giving town mayors full world guard rights, which could easily be abused anywhere in the game world, or admins would have to manually mark the regions for the Mayor which would take hours and hours and hours. Until someone can recode Herotowns it's just not easily possible.
We're moving Townships to Worldguard, @gabizou
 

Eldrylars

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Apr 28, 2012
Location
Dragon through ...
We're moving Townships to Worldguard, @gabizou

Hmm, interesting.
Does worldguard allow region admins to sub-region by default?

The entire problem with town theft could easily be corrected without LWCs with region admins able to create subregions.

Town architects/trusted member get full region access while new members only get access to their plot /front door.
 

Kainzo

The Disposable Hero
Staff member
Founder
Adventure Team
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Location
The 7th Circle of Heaven
Hmm, interesting.
Does worldguard allow region admins to sub-region by default?

The entire problem with town theft could easily be corrected without LWCs with region admins able to create subregions.

Town architects/trusted member get full region access while new members only get access to their plot /front door.
Hoping to have a working system somewhat soon.
 

lioIIoil

Legacy Supporter 7
Joined
Jun 23, 2012
Hmm, interesting.
Does worldguard allow region admins to sub-region by default?

The entire problem with town theft could easily be corrected without LWCs with region admins able to create subregions.

Town architects/trusted member get full region access while new members only get access to their plot /front door.
We will also need to confront thehackerx.
 

Symbolite

Legacy Supporter 7
Joined
Jan 14, 2011
Child regions would totally be a life saver! Thanks Kainzo for looking into this, really missed those little child regions we could make on Sanctum.
 

Dielan9999

Legacy Supporter 5
Joined
Mar 9, 2011
Location
Temple of Melonmancy
Child regions would fix alot of things that are wrong with town recruiting in Herocraft today.

Just like in real life, you can go digging outside of your property, and you can dig in your property unless you own it. With subregions, mayors can limit the permissions given to new players. Individual plots can be exclusive, and public town structures like town halls/gates/etc can be on limits so people can move about the town and stuff.
 

STDs4YouAnd4Me

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Sep 11, 2012
I don't like the idea of raising LWCs across the board, and definitely don't like the idea of adding LWCs depending on your Town's rank. It'll come to the point where 'raiding' a town would be useless since every chest is locked.

If you want to go that route, I suggest having a weekly tax on each LWC chest you own. It'll make you think "do I really want to pay a weekly tax on this stuff?"

Furthermore, it sucks to get your stuff stolen by town members. I can't imagine that happening to me, but I imagine I'd be furious. On the other side of the spectrum, MOST towns accept anyone in their towns without giving it a second thought. If you're literally going to accept any clown who applies, expect trouble. The Kingdom life is not the life for me.
 

leftovers5

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Oct 28, 2011
Location
USA
I don't like the idea of raising LWCs across the board, and definitely don't like the idea of adding LWCs depending on your Town's rank. It'll come to the point where 'raiding' a town would be useless since every chest is locked.

If you want to go that route, I suggest having a weekly tax on each LWC chest you own. It'll make you think "do I really want to pay a weekly tax on this stuff?"

Furthermore, it sucks to get your stuff stolen by town members. I can't imagine that happening to me, but I imagine I'd be furious. On the other side of the spectrum, MOST towns accept anyone in their towns without giving it a second thought. If you're literally going to accept any clown who applies, expect trouble. The Kingdom life is not the life for me.
On the same token, why should towns that actively recruit be penalized?
 

Jack_Reacher

Legacy Supporter 7
Joined
Feb 4, 2011
Ah, I don't think it makes sense to call that "penalizing", or that large towns are singled-out. In fact, everyone has to deal with this. It's just harder in larger towns. If you leave an unlocked chest of gold in the wilderness, I'd say: "expect trouble".

A very similar situation occurs when towns are liberal with admissions - ESSENTIALLY, there is a an unlocked chest of your gold, and all I have to do is make a forum post saying I won't take the gold in order to have access to it. It seems inevitable that some derp is going to steal your gold even at risk of getting banned.

Also... donor regions! If you want to have safe warehouses, make donor regions where you can restrict access to trusted members of the town. Otherwise... yep. LWCs.
 

xexorian

Admin ZeeZo
Retired Staff
Joined
Apr 7, 2011
Location
USA
Ah, I don't think it makes sense to call that "penalizing", or that large towns are singled-out. In fact, everyone has to deal with this. It's just harder in larger towns. If you leave an unlocked chest of gold in the wilderness, I'd say: "expect trouble".

A very similar situation occurs when towns are liberal with admissions - ESSENTIALLY, there is a an unlocked chest of your gold, and all I have to do is make a forum post saying I won't take the gold in order to have access to it. It seems inevitable that some derp is going to steal your gold even at risk of getting banned.

Also... donor regions! If you want to have safe warehouses, make donor regions where you can restrict access to trusted members of the town. Otherwise... yep. LWCs.

This is not the problem.

You (and others) are making false-pretenses, and assuming everyone is out to dupe gold. Stop it. These people are out to kill townships, kingdoms, and ruin our fun as a community.

We could go as far as not restoring gold specifically if this is an actual problem, and still restore everything else. It's not like anything else is used for anything aside from building or PVP. IF people started duping diamonds for bans, A) there wouldn't even be a reasonable amount or it would be caught, and B) even if it happened over a long period of time, items still go down in price as more are on the map, and this would just mean we could see fancier structures and see a better built world in a shorter amount of time. ASSUMING every single case from hence forth would be ONLY to dupe and bypass the rules, and they would NEVER ever be caught becuase we are ALL slippery mother fudge packers capable of that. Yeah, get real. You are so toxic it makes me burn just reading your bogus texts. You are crazy if that's what you believe and you should check yourself and think twice. Be more realistic, and logical. Most of these people would not grief anymore if there wasn't a way to "win" by destroying others precious time, and valuables.

As symbolite said, everything is of worth, including the last stack of 64 cobblestone I just had. :mad:
 
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