Suggestion "Global Mute" change?

[xpeterc1]

I have no idea if this has been brought up for debate but the idea of an overall mute is a little over the top. It renders the player unable to chat with other players other than Teamspeak (for those that use it at all), most of the time the "Globally Muted" person comes in contact with another player or wish to communicate something but is unable too unless they are clever like party chat (would have to party the person first) this makes combat situations unavoidable for players or in a recent case a player spamed the PE to contact staff.

I have no idea of the full story for each indivual player who have been globally muted. A full global mute hinders a players ability to play Herocraft.

MY SUGGESTION:
Instead a global mute that disable chat for the player all together, they are only muted in the "Global" channels like in Off-topic, trade, help, Elite.
BUT still have access to shout/local, and their town chat/private chats.

I feel this would be a better situation for the player and everyone else since that player is unable to communicate to the entire community of their "Negative opinions" they are still able to communicate with their town.
A full disable use of chat for the player may be an extreme because it leaves them with little options in the game.

Again, my suggestion for better players experience.


EDIT:
This is debatable for being lean on rules or not from what I am sensing from you. many times it is someone's opinion that leads to a global mute while showing power to quell the opposing force is a good way to dispel unwanted action. I believe there has been perm-mutes because of someone voice their opinion on a subject and I am voicing for my concern for being a bit extreme on the whole opinion leading to belittled playing conditions.

If anything leave them with shout/local and if they want back in form their seclusion of chat then let them write an appeal. Total Mute is way too harsh in my opinion because it leaves them with no way to communicate and ostracizing them from ALL of the community. At least this way they can fend for themselves with some voice as they hermit through the land.

I understand that why a full mute is used and is necessary but many of the cases that have been from minor offenses. The use of a global mute is short of a temp-ban in my definition because it leaves the player in a state that they can play but isolated from the community, almost like serving a sentence but in a dehumanizing sort of way. -There is a story like this, cant remember title.
I don't know the entire time period of the mute (hours-weeks) and while chatting is a privilege for everyone, this privilege is a necessary tool to play in the world of Herocraft. A necessary tool that once taken away leaves then with nothing, that is the extreme I am addressing that chatting is necessary to play in any server.
If you agree that communication is necessary to play in Herocraft then there is very little difference from a ban if they are globally muted because the mute would be taking too much away from playing. There should be a better gauge of offenses if ban & global mute are this close.
Make a new set:
"Global Mute from off-chat/trade/elite/help" >> "Total mute" >> BAN.
Minor offenses, harsher offenders , and finally hackers/exploiters.

 

[Neotetro]

We understand that global mutes are extremely limiting on players, but most are for a limited amount of time, usually a few hours to a week. This inability to speak is their punishment as they have abused the privilege to speak. Global chats are not a right, they are a privilege. Abuse of that will lead to mutes, longer mutes and eventually bans.

 

[aceshooter11]

Or even just a ban from the channels they should be form in a case by case

 

[Neotetro]

Or even just a ban from the channels they should be form in a case by case

We are able to do that, muting in any particular channel. If it's a global mute, it's for something very serious, or for repeated offense. Usually people are muted in the channel they offend in,

 

[xpeterc1]

"Usually people are muted in the channel they offend in"
Not to twist your words around but if they did it in global like the Off-Chat channel, they abused their privilege in Off-Chat and should be penalized in Off-Chat, not the entire chat. I still think a ME is a little harsh for a total mute of all chat.
I am only generalizing but most of the time it is nothing bad unless it is someone who is spamming then that would be a ban/global mute.

This is debatable for being lean on rules or not from what I am sensing from you, many times it is someone's opinion that leads to a global mute while showing power to quell the opposing force is a good way to dispel unwanted action. I believe there has been perm-mutes because of someone voice their opinion on a subject and I am voicing for my concern for being a bit extreme on the whole opinion leading to belittled playing conditions.

If anything leave them with shout/local and if they want back in form their seclusion of chat then let them write an appeal. Total Mute is way too harsh in my opinion because it leaves them with no way to communicate and ostracizing them from ALL of the community. At least this way they can fend for themselves with some voice.

 

[Angyles]

Problem is, sometimes the person is muted in one channel, they go to another to spam like trade. Why should someone like that have the ability to speak at all? If they are going to be immature enough to spam in other channels, they should not have the right to speak at all for a limited time.

I do like the idea of having the ability to speak in local only when they are removed from other channels, but if someone really wants to be a pain they could spam that as well.

 

[xpeterc1]

Problem is, sometimes the person is muted in one channel, they go to another to spam like trade. Why should someone like that have the ability to speak at all? If they are going to be immature enough to spam in other channels, they should not have the right to speak at all for a limited time.

I do like the idea of having the ability to speak in local only when they are removed from other channels, but if someone really wants to be a pain they could spam that as well.

Yes, this is what I am advocating, "Global Channels", the ones that the communities are all in like Off-Chat, Help, Trade, Elite. I was calling them "Global Channels" since they are accessed by everyone and just leave them with the private channels or some form of communication that not everyone is in. The private channels are managed by the mods of those channels, while I see a flaw in my logic since he could easily join a new channel.
An addition to this was unable to join a new channel? or just limit to only local/shout.

To address to the annoying ones who will spam, then move them up to a Full Global Mute, I don't want to lump everyone into that group. Right now we have the minor offenders for their opinions mixed in the same group as those that break rules like the use of ME. This suggestion will at least separate the minor offenders from the real offenders.

 

[Angyles]

If someone has received the offense now to be globally muted, why should they get the right to chat in private chats? As it is now, they are muted in individual channels first, and then it moved to global when they are being tards.

 

[xpeterc1]

If someone has received the offense now to be globally muted, why should they get the right to chat in private chats? As it is now, they are muted in individual channels first, and then it moved to global when they are being tards.

There are different scenarios that I see, I am looking from those that have been escalated from a good standing to a full mute because they expressed their opinion like in the recent off-topic debate of "Mac vs PC" and it got out of hand. The offenses that you are mentioning are the people who would be in a different category that are being annoying because they are trying to troll and then would receive a more serve admonishment than people that just have disagreements.

Those tards you mentions would just be escalated to a different punishment, I am trying to separate those "tards" from the minor offenders so they wont be in the same boat.
Can't you agree that some people who been global muted in the past were not all tards?
-if they are all tards, in my view then they would not have been appealed .

What is wrong with my suggestion since I thought it would be better for players, I see no fault since that everyone is either given a full mute or a ban. Instead of a full Mute for an hour-weeks where they can't communicate to players for what I see as minor offenses. It is very vague of the levels of admonishment other than a ban/mute with the time given. This is just another option for small offenses and first timers?

Calling someone an idiot or being mean should not right away lead to a full mute, I agree that everyone should be nice when they play with others. The thing is that, maybe the player slipped up on the situation and got carried away, remind the player to keep calm and move on from that situation. -This is a kind of offenses that I believe would kick them from the "Global channels" for a short time instead of a total mute since it is understandable for why people rage.
Repeated offenses like this should give a hints to mods that they deserve a global mute but why are we lumping everyone in such a boat.

I still feel that there should just be more options.

 

[Angyles]

Oh trust me I get what you are saying and I am just playing "devil's advocate" as it were. I was not on during the "PC/Mac" war, so I am unsure what really happened. Perhaps because the discussion got out of hand ((Again I was not there so I am unsure)) that the fear was the other channels would be spammed as well.

 

[xpeterc1]

Oh trust me I get what you are saying and I am just playing "devil's advocate" as it were. I was not on during the "PC/Mac" war, so I am unsure what really happened. Perhaps because the discussion got out of hand ((Again I was not there so I am unsure)) that the fear was the other channels would be spammed as well.

I agree, I just added a new scenario again repeating that there should just be more than two options of a total mute or a ban since there are way more situations that would be consider offenses but not enough to justify between these two in my opinion. Someone may just be having a bad day and while it is wrong for him to use the chat as a forum for his anger, don't just put him in total mute. "Just limit him, don't kill him". or If he becomes a bear, turn him into a rabbit don't kill him. (No idea, trying to sound wise)

Again I don't want to lump those people who spam channels as trolls with "minor offenders/first time offenders who slip up, there been people who just forgot there was a ME and used it or something."

-for others-
Well this is getting no where because while I just see a grey area of the rules that just seem to harsh for some people, others may view it as a necessary evil and now off to class.

 

[Plasma78]

There are different scenarios that I see, I am looking from those that have been escalated from a good standing to a full mute because they expressed their opinion like in the recent off-topic debate of "Mac vs PC" and it got out of hand. The offenses that you are mentioning are the people who would be in a different category that are being annoying because they are trying to troll and then would receive a more serve admonishment than people that just have disagreements.

Those tards you mentions would just be escalated to a different punishment, I am trying to separate those "tards" from the minor offenders so they wont be in the same boat.
Can't you agree that some people who been global muted in the past were not all tards?
-if they are all tards, in my view then they would not have been appealed .

What is wrong with my suggestion since I thought it would be better for players, I see no fault since that everyone is either given a full mute or a ban. Instead of a full Mute for an hour-weeks where they can't communicate to players for what I see as minor offenses. It is very vague of the levels of admonishment other than a ban/mute with the time given. This is just another option for small offenses and first timers?

Its a user by user, case by case basis. The player will get plenty of warning before hand for minor things, like spamming, or just being a tard. If its a more serious offense, yes the player can possibly be globally muted.

Its a privilege to 'talk' , not a right. old saying, THINK BEFORE YOU SPEAK.

Some players dont get the hint of 'hey that is not appropriate for chat etc' and thus have to be muted for the betterment of the community. ( many player are repeat offenders of being muted, hence why they get muted for various issues, everything is logged on server)

What you may see as a minor offense maybe the players 100th time being warned/muted and further action is needed at that point.

As stated before the offending parties are given quite a few chances to stop, i am sure you have seen admins/mods/guides in the various chats, telling players to knock it off, or let it go, etc.
That is a hint to let that subject drop, close the chapter and move on. Some players keep on it, and they earn a mute, only to find out later, its hard to play the game at that point.


To sum up, its a privilege, not a right. Keep that in mind when chatting in game.

 

[xpeterc1]

Its a user by user, case by case basis. The player will get plenty of warning before hand for minor things, like spamming, or just being a tard. If its a more serious offense, yes the player can possibly be globally muted.

Its a privilege to 'talk' , not a right. old saying, THINK BEFORE YOU SPEAK.

Some players dont get the hint of 'hey that is not appropriate for chat etc' and thus have to be muted for the betterment of the community. ( many player are repeat offenders of being muted, hence why they get muted for various issues, everything is logged on server)

What you may see as a minor offense maybe the players 100th time being warned/muted and further action is needed at that point.

As stated before the offending parties are given quite a few chances to stop, i am sure you have seen admins/mods/guides in the various chats, telling players to knock it off, or let it go, etc.
That is a hint to let that subject drop, close the chapter and move on. Some players keep on it, and they earn a mute, only to find out later, its hard to play the game at that point.


To sum up, its a privilege, not a right. Keep that in mind when chatting in game.

Well I agree with the privilege rule because it falls under everything that should be used to justify mutes.
I agree that somes are tards that need to be told to stop their actions should get the full mute because it is viewed unappropriated to the community. The emulation of these events happen over again and the idea that is the necessary evil to shut those people up.

There is many instances who said they slip up who I believe are lying and just say the generic "I slipped up, sorry please unmute me" bullshit but I am also sure that somewhere in that sludge is a true person who really did not mean to say it and received a mute because they said "you mad" that one time and got full muted.
Because it falls under the ME and is viewed negatively, it is taken up as intentional while it may not has been.
-point short, not everyone should be viewed to take the full blow of the law, there should be different levels.
Different levels of lying-
perjury one- deny WWII happen.
perjury nine- said they had sex with someone when they didn't to friends.

I give up, while the rules should be strict because it should reflect the age group of the server. I firmly believe there should be at least gaps in between to accommodate the middle groups instead of a black and white and let the grey settle into a new group.
If someone thought that I was the one in my story who was muted, let me clear it up that no, I was not muted but just voicing what I believed was a fair idea to give more options for the rules.

 

[Plasma78]

I see your point and some times mistakes are made, typing in the wrong channel etc.
There are gaps to an extent but overall the rules/process works very well.
There are different levels, you get a warnings, then action is taken if you dont stop.

Think of it as a stop light, green is good, and most player abide by it.
however, when yellow light is on, means caution, admin/mods/guides are saying knock it off, red light is coming, most players ignore this and hit the gas, and try to beat it. They keep on that path and they
ends up going thro a red light, ie a mute.

Each person knows the server limits what are, and lines not to be crossed server or online, etc.
The regular players know the rules, have seen the on goings in chat, and know what is allowed/what is not.
This kinda polices itself to a degree, community wise.

The rules are clearly stated all over , forums, wiki.

Chat Rules
The following actions are prohibited while in in-game chat channels, irc, teamspeak, and any Herocraft Online related forums:

• Harassing, threatening, embarrassing, giving unwanted attention or discomfort to another player.
• Impersonation of any Herocraft Online staff member.
• Marketing, promoting or advertising of anything, or making any other form of solicitation.
  • This does not include items sold on Herocraft Online Service that are indigenous to Minecraft or Herocraft.
• The use of any language besides English in main chat channels (global, trade, help, off-topic).
  • This includes e-bonics, internet m.emes, and various other forms of slang.
• Spamming, begging, whining, and other similar forms of unwanted chat clutter.
• Encouraging others to violate the rules set by staff.

as is the enforcement of breaking said rules,( there are other rules along with the chat rules)
so say player 1 comes on and is spamming chat. he could receive a warning and that be the end of it.
however he could be a repeat offender, and after being warned is becoming more of an issue at that point.
( not to mention the wall of text in game you have to sit thro, and sift thro....)
at that point player 1 could be muted to benefit the community. Now player 1 wants to go buy a port and cannot due to he/she cannot type in chat.
That is the players fault for not thinking, and now he realizes the consequences of his/her actions.
If your on the server or anywhere for that matter, be mindful of what is allowed and not.

Just cause you can do something doesn't mean you should.

 

[xpeterc1]

To Conclude:
Yes, I understand because the internet is full of people who believe they can hide behind their monitors is what gets them into trouble. Being strict will have better outcomes for the server because it combines all those people into a mix, those that are innocents they will be filtered later on, if they use the appeal system.

Was not arguing against the rules, but the process of placing where people fall under was the idea. The rules state this but it's up to the judge to decide how harsh of a punishment is given based on their thoughts of the situations and sometimes their punishment don't fit the crime. Just my thoughts from what I gather. I saw a tiny group that I believed were mistreated, I can say my position is trying to bring up this issue and raise awareness and that I saw people throwing out Mute/Ban as taser gun. The situation might now had justify the use of such extreme of not letting them play. Of course by now, I am only address the groups that were innocently accused not the "tards".

I know that there is the reserved rights of the staff to distribute these punishments as they see fit, but again with the taser gun or pepper spray analogy. It's just easy to throw these around when they feel it might be necessary but what about the minor cases, there are different levels of crime commented that they may not necessary fall under the current two system of mute/ban.

Summing it up, I know that warnings are given first before punishments are handed out. Dealing with situations all the time in a fair manner may not be a viable option for the server because it may lack man power and that it is a pain in general. There will be no fair methods in dealing with the groups, there was no brainstorm with the criticisms so I did not reach the idea I was trying to polish myself on a more fair system. I am trying to look out for the new-comers and making a more ideal situation for them which may not be helpful for the community itself because mods have included their input of the situation.

I apologize if this offended anyone because they believed my tone was that staff was not going a good job, it was not my intention, rather I was trying to help raise an issues I believed were important and my comments aimed at the issues that I believe some people are really innocent and didn't deserve such a harsh punishment because of the two available option. While initial warning are given first, I believe some people were given it straight off the bat which is what lead me to write this in the first place. I assumed I had a better picture from what I gather from both sides beside lack of detail of the process until mods gave input. Many of the previous threads that probably could have mentions the staff input were closed and could not have further input from them due to their nature of turning into a flame war.

While all available suggestions I gave, people shot down because of possible scheming from the player.
*Mute from "Global" but left with town chats & local/shout = people troll in different town channels.
*Only left with local/shout = people just shouting and annoying people locally.
-The idea is not give the tards these but the minor offenders.

So I guess harsh punishment is only left with the idea that everyone should be seen equal under the rules even if it means that they will be left with little options when trying to communicate ingame. -well the innocent will get their appeal I guess but as I said it's not fair for them but.....
it's not fair for the staff to work out this problem since of the lack of manpower for all the issues addressed.

Not going to argue anymore since my points were made and aware off. My suggestion does not work well when there will be people who may exploit what I was trying to address and use it for their own benefits when I wanted something a bit more relaxed since a total mute may be too hard on someone to play with but as we should all know, maybe not some. "Deal with it".
Still believe some are innocent and didn't deserve a mute!

Peace. Sorry for the lack of advancements made in the thread other than a rant really.
Again, I apologize to anyone who found this insulting.
Still trying to figure out ways to give a more positive experience for new-comers while not negatively impacting the community already.

We can view these possible options in the future for those that choose to pursuit it.
Lets leave this to rest since it has flaws that will not be resolved in a thread, especially if it goes like this.