Suggestion Bring back the old classes!

[Jrr_]

Howdy!

So as we call know the herocraft community has come to a down point in its time where people a drifting away playing other games and playing on other servers. These people are majority pvp'ers and they say that there is NO pvp. But the reason why there is NO pvp in the first place is because people are not logging on because they are simply bored of the server.

But what are they bored of?

I truly believe the fact people are getting bored of the server and are moving on is that they are sick and tired of the old same classes. The same basic 16 or 17 classes with nothing else to try out. When you are new the server you find it to be very fun but when you become a knowledgable player of herocraft you get old of the same classes where when you are new you keep learning and discovering classes to try out that you have not done so yet.

What does this mean?

I believe it is digging time, I think that we need to bring back all the old classes from where we have gotten rid of for example Mason and Samurai, which is coming back! These classes are already coded so they only may need to be updated and balance. I am not a coder so I don't know if you might need to re do skills but I am sure people would love to see this happen. As well as old classes coming back maybe we could really get dirty and produce some more classes to play. Now I know this would take some time to code all these new classes but I really strongly believe this would be a big success if this were to happen.

To end my point here I think that if we have more classes then people can try out of heaps of classes and not get bored of the same old ones. We can have people trying out brand new classes and having heaps more fun again and also seeing old players playing some of their old fun classes as mentioned above before. I know this could take a mountain of work but if we could recruit some more devs I think this would be a nice thing to do.

Thanks Jrr

 

[has400]

word brother

 

[LightningCape]

Howdy!

So as we call know the herocraft community has come to a down point in its time where people a drifting away playing other games and playing on other servers. These people are majority pvp'ers and they say that there is NO pvp. But the reason why there is NO pvp in the first place is because people are not logging on because they are simply bored of the server.

But what are they bored of?

I truly believe the fact people are getting bored of the server and are moving on is that they are sick and tired of the old same classes. The same basic 16 or 17 classes with nothing else to try out. When you are new the server you find it to be very fun but when you become a knowledgable player of herocraft you get old of the same classes where when you are new you keep learning and discovering classes to try out that you have not done so yet.

What does this mean?

I believe it is digging time, I think that we need to bring back all the old classes from where we have gotten rid of for example Mason and Samurai, which is coming back! These classes are already coded so they only may need to be updated and balance. I am not a coder so I don't know if you might need to re do skills but I am sure people would love to see this happen. As well as old classes coming back maybe we could really get dirty and produce some more classes to play. Now I know this would take some time to code all these new classes but I really strongly believe this would be a big success if this were to happen.

To end my point here I think that if we have more classes then people can try out of heaps of classes and not get bored of the same old ones. We can have people trying out brand new classes and having heaps more fun again and also seeing old players playing some of their old fun classes as mentioned above before. I know this could take a mountain of work but if we could recruit some more devs I think this would be a nice thing to do.

Thanks Jrr

Not sure if you meant to but this comes off as very ill-informed.

Pointing to one aspect of the server and saying that is the only reason why the population hasn't been what it has been is completely ridiculous. Speaking in absolutes will hardly get you anywhere in general. Also not sure if you've been looking around but we have old classes coming back and hopefully more will follow. They are currently in development and as someone on the balance team you should know this.

 

[Jrr_]

Not sure if you meant to but this comes off as very ill-informed.

Pointing to one aspect of the server and saying that is the only reason why the population hasn't been what it has been is completely ridiculous. Speaking in absolutes will hardly get you anywhere in general. Also not sure if you've been looking around but we have old classes coming back and hopefully more will follow. They are currently in development and as someone on the balance team you should know this.

As I stated in the thread I know samurai is coming back so I do know and was saying that hopefully more come back. And I do know this isn't the only reason why people are leaving, I was just pointing out one opinion, not sure why you are having little bit of a go at me here when all I am trying to do is help...

 

[Beau_Nearh]

Before we even consider adding any more classes (I'm against samurai being implemented at the moment) we should balance the ones we currently have correctly. There's no point adding additional content if the foundations aren't set properly. Setting a baseline will make balancing new content ALOT easier. Time line wise it should go;

Balance all existing classes --> make sure all classes are indeed balanced correctly --> fix other key gameplay mechanics --> move onto lower priority projects that are indeed related to key gameplay mechanics --> add additional content.

 

[CoolBeans279]

Before we even consider adding any more classes (I'm against samurai being implemented at the moment) we should balance the ones we currently have correctly. There's no point adding additional content if the foundations aren't set properly. Setting a baseline will make balancing new content ALOT easier. Time line wise it should go;

Balance all existing classes --> make sure all classes are indeed balanced correctly --> fix other key gameplay mechanics --> move onto lower priority projects that are indeed related to key gameplay mechanics --> add additional content.

Are you stupid?!?! bringing Samurai back is one of the smartest ideas in the world, and with the current balance team members this will work out great.

 

[Irishman81]

Before we even consider adding any more classes (I'm against samurai being implemented at the moment) we should balance the ones we currently have correctly. There's no point adding additional content if the foundations aren't set properly. Setting a baseline will make balancing new content ALOT easier. Time line wise it should go;

Balance all existing classes --> make sure all classes are indeed balanced correctly --> fix other key gameplay mechanics --> move onto lower priority projects that are indeed related to key gameplay mechanics --> add additional content.

I'm curious to see what exactly you would like to see balanced. I often see complaints in chat saying, "ohhhh balance team isn't doing anything the classes are broken" but when I ask what they want to see changed they don't respond.

 

[malikdanab]

Are you stupid?!?! bringing Samurai back is one of the smartest ideas in the world, and with the current balance team members this will work out great.

Except that samurai won't be like the old one at all and like beau said, we don't have a baseline to balance Samurai around.

 

[Beau_Nearh]

I'm curious to see what exactly you would like to see balanced. I often see complaints in chat saying, "ohhhh balance team isn't doing anything the classes are broken" but when I ask what they want to see changed they don't respond.

At no point have I accused balance of not doing their job as I can see many discussions being made by balance members about classes/ content. However, class wise I'd like to see paladin as well as dread knight 'fixed' for a starter. I'd also like to see something done about ranger too. Then go from there but I would suggest going though each category of class one at a time making the changes. Other than that balance is doing a good job?

 

[CoolBeans279]

Except that samurai won't be like the old one at all and like beau said, we don't have a baseline to balance Samurai around.

Yet everyone would like to see Samurai over anything else.

EDIT: My point is bringing back Samurai is a smart move, and the people we have working on it are perfectly fit for the job.

 

[Beau_Nearh]

Are you stupid?!?! bringing Samurai back is one of the smartest ideas in the world, and with the current balance team members this will work out great.

Im guessing you've just skimmed though the text, right? My whole post was about balancing the current classes. Setting a baseline with all existing classes should be top priority rather than adding new classes. If or when the classes are balanced to the point no more changes are needed to be made, I'll be just as happy as anyone for new content. Adding it while existing content is broke would 1.) make it a lot harder to produce a balanced class & 2.) Give balance and staff a lot more content to try and balance all together.

To cut it short, new content should be balanced on existing content. Not existing content being balanced with new content in mind.

 

[Beau_Nearh]

@CoolBeans279 think of it this way. How would you build a house? You would first create a foundation for that house to sit on. Without that foundation, the house can collapse or have serious problems later down the line. This is exactly the same principle here. Without a set baseline, more problems and issues which could of been avoided will show up.

 

[Jrr_]

@CoolBeans279 think of it this way. How would you build a house? You would first create a foundation for that house to sit on. Without that foundation, the house can collapse or have serious problems later down the line. This is exactly the same principle here. Without a set baseline, more problems and issues which could of been avoided will show up.

Keep it on topic.

EDIT, facepalms...

 

[Beau_Nearh]

Keep it on topic.

This is very specific to the topic? If you're on about the idiot part I already edited it out before you replied, I know I shouldn't of said it

 

[Kainzo]

The goal is to balance the current set of classes before bringing out old or new ones. It's important to get things in line before packing in classes.

I see Herocraft in the right direction. We cant force players to play Minecraft or Herocraft and the ones that do will hopefully enjoy it.

 

[Jrr_]

The goal is to balance the current set of classes before bringing out old or new ones. It's important to get things in line before packing in classes.

I see Herocraft in the right direction. We cant force players to play Minecraft or Herocraft and the ones that do will hopefully enjoy it.

I agree 100%, could we see this happen though in the near future? thanks for your reply.

 

[Kydone]

Alright guys, I followed the discussion and I will tell you my experiences from another heroes server. First thing is: new and old things are not better! Nobody will come back, because there is a new class. Maybe they try it out, but they will leave again, if they maxed the class and are bored of it. The biggest problem imo is, if there are too many new features. The players, who are new to the server understand nothing, because its too much and that are mostly the players a server live of. You dont need all the old players again... You need new! And the best way to get these is, to make the gameplay easier and better. Balancing is there a good way to start. The goal is to change, what you have and ake this more attractive. I dont like the raiding system for example. This could be much more interesting, if skills for raiding are splitted to some classes and teamplay is required.
Hope this helped a bit.
P.S: If you found some grammaticfails you can keep them ;*

 

[Beau_Nearh]

Alright guys, I followed the discussion and I will tell you my experiences from another heroes server. First thing is: new and old things are not better! Nobody will come back, because there is a new class. Maybe they try it out, but they will leave again, if they maxed the class and are bored of it. The biggest problem imo is, if there are too many new features. The players, who are new to the server understand nothing, because its too much and that are mostly the players a server live of. You dont need all the old players again... You need new! And the best way to get these is, to make the gameplay easier and better. Balancing is there a good way to start. The goal is to change, what you have and ake this more attractive. I dont like the raiding system for example. This could be much more interesting, if skills for raiding are splitted to some classes and teamplay is required.
Hope this helped a bit.
P.S: If you found some grammaticfails you can keep them ;*

Hm, you seem to have a few ideas. Make a separate thread fleshing out your ideas and I'll happily give you feedback

 

[JupiterRome]

Before we even consider adding any more classes (I'm against samurai being implemented at the moment) we should balance the ones we currently have correctly. There's no point adding additional content if the foundations aren't set properly. Setting a baseline will make balancing new content ALOT easier. Time line wise it should go;

Balance all existing classes --> make sure all classes are indeed balanced correctly --> fix other key gameplay mechanics --> move onto lower priority projects that are indeed related to key gameplay mechanics --> add additional content.

its funny Because When Samurais Wasn't Being worked on I said this, But Frankly Its not happening, New things will always be put ahead of Balance Because Balance is tbh hard to make, Balance Team has a pretty hard job Separating an Over Powered Class and a Well Played Class, like Danda said in the tourney "I think balance team needs to take a look at healing" When you look at it Yes Healing does look overpowered in the scenario, But then you look at the tourney teams
Cleric,Bloodmage,Paladin,Disciple,Disciple
Bard,Cleric,Disciple,Disciple,Druid
So when you look at it RS most likely had Bloodbonds up Cleric healing Fist of Jin Instant 200 HP from the Chakras a Layhands absolution And 2 Holy Auras Up,
And then There was HealingChorus,Holyaura + cleric Heals, Healing bloom, Druid heals and 2 Disciples (See above)
Absolution is like what 250ish too? and Renewal is like 200?

This is an example of where balance needs to separate overpowered classes from Well Played classes with a Team Comp that Steroids where designed off of. So At First Glance Healing looks overpowered but when you look at it EVERYBODY in the Final Round had Healing. And They didn't Have any Huge damage sources besides RSHooter, this is why it took forever when you have 5 healers on each side what do you expect?

So to Get back on track, this is why Balancing cant always (no matter how much I wish it did) come first, Its hard to tell if a class is overpowered Because to Be completely honest if a class is played to its best it usually is very strong due to the player.

Balance has a Hard Job.

edit* @Dsawemd LOOK WHO GOT DEM ORGANIZED POSTS NOW :O

 

[Beau_Nearh]

its funny Because When Samurais Wasn't Being worked on I said this, But Frankly Its not happening, New things will always be put ahead of Balance Because Balance is tbh hard to make, Balance Team has a pretty hard job Separating an Over Powered Class and a Well Played Class, like Danda said in the tourney "I think balance team needs to take a look at healing" When you look at it Yes Healing does look overpowered in the scenario, But then you look at the tourney teams
Cleric,Bloodmage,Paladin,Disciple,Disciple
Bard,Cleric,Disciple,Disciple,Druid
So when you look at it RS most likely had Bloodbonds up Cleric healing Fist of Jin Instant 200 HP from the Chakras a Layhands absolution And 2 Holy Auras Up,
And then There was HealingChorus,Holyaura + cleric Heals, Healing bloom, Druid heals and 2 Disciples (See above)
Absolution is like what 250ish too? and Renewal is like 200?

This is an example of where balance needs to separate overpowered classes from Well Played classes with a Team Comp that Steroids where designed off of. So At First Glance Healing looks overpowered but when you look at it EVERYBODY in the Final Round had Healing. And They didn't Have any Huge damage sources besides RSHooter, this is why it took forever when you have 5 healers on each side what do you expect?

So to Get back on track, this is why Balancing cant always (no matter how much I wish it did) come first, Its hard to tell if a class is overpowered Because to Be completely honest if a class is played to its best it usually is very strong due to the player.

Balance has a Hard Job.

edit* @Dsawemd LOOK WHO GOT DEM ORGANIZED POSTS NOW :O

Oh, I must not of saw your post then I'm afraid but well the only solution to the healing problem I can see is to cap the amount if active heals a player can have at one point to x amount of sources. That should deal with that right? But anyway classes shouldn't be so heavily balanced around what combos they come in with a few exceptions (cleric is a great example). But it should keep in mind team play as that is a big aspect of herocraft.

But I'm sure we both can agree on a few certain classes needing some love. I might make a straw poll later with the question "what class do you think needs updating", or something down those lines.