Suggestion wizards might need slight rework...

[mikehk]

Wizards may need a slight rework. Reasons:
icebolt+fireball+fireblast+root+bolt=somewhere around 830 damage, which is enough to kill alot of classes/specs if hit right, which because of root, it will almost always hit if used right, icebolt also prevents the target from escaping.
reasoning:
icebolt=180ish?+slow
fireball=175+5 fire ticks=200
fireblast=200
bolt=250
combine all together for 830 damage. if this does not kill the target, the wizard has to simply blink into a tree or blink farther away than the target can catch up or reach.
also the wizard can use shock or megabolt as well in these situations, which will add another 400ish damage, causeing the wizard to have a damage output of 1230 damage in about 5 seconds. and again, the wizard can blink away if ever needed, through a 1x1 hole, up a tree, farther away, closer to the target, etc.

 

[LightningCape]

Seems like your describing an experience rather than suggesting something.

 

[judgedread540]

No, No and No.
If that happened then you clearly do not know how to play pyromancer. You need keep trying to get close to the wizard, flameshield will stop fireball doing any damage what so ever. Also icebolt + fireball alone do NOT take you down to 3 hearts are you saying that together they do 560hp all together?.

Another point adressing pyros innability to get near to someone. As soon as Chaos Orb is fixed and actually tp's then you'll be able to use that to get close + to also confuse the enemy.

This is not a suggestion and just a certain situation, asking for a class to be completely remade because of one fight is stupid. You have no true figure to support your comment. Wizard is pretty strong at the moment as they just gained icebolt allowing them to keep you still for a lot longer than before but they do not need reworking.

 

[leftovers5]

Something is wrong with this post. Seems too whiny. Wizards are currently pretty well balanced.

 

[Mrchucklez]

I good counter for a pyro is to use flameshield when your rooted so you can deflect the wizards fireball and fireblast, therefore preventing half the wizards combo damage and then you can take it from there with chaos orb or whatever

 

[Diffuse]

I'm not 100% sure but I don't think flameshield absorbs fireblast or the initial damage from fireball.

Even if it does the average fight for any melee will be:
Run at enemy -> get rooted -> icebolt, fireball, fireblast (-475ish hp) -> blink -> blink -> repeat

Blink is on too low of a cooldown for any melee class to have the hopes of catching up to a wizard (except bard with super jesus mode wtf permanent one and super jesus mode wtf aoe impale).

The other problem I have with wizards is the fact that they even have fireblast. Fireblast just seems like a skill that gets tagged onto a class simply because the class needs a little bit of free damage, and wizards seriously don't need it.

Suggestions:
-remove fireblast, wizards do not need it to do good damage and it fits pyro better anyway
OR
-raise CD of blink to like 15 seconds because seriously, why is a super high damage class with 2 slows also the second most mobile?

 

[macura]

When fighting a wizard my best advice would be to prevent them from icebolting you after they root you. Root breaks on damage and does not silence so it is quite easy to counter. My best advice would be to fireball them if they are out of fireblast or blaze range.

Also Diffuse, to answer your question wizards need high mobility to make up for them being so squishy and dealing with warmups. Wizards have around 60-160 lower hp max hp than all the other caster specs, and the only caster spec that has a warmup on a good portion on their skills. The combination of being the squishiest of all hero specs and being forced to apply slows to yourself to deal a good portion of your damage output.

On the point of cc-burst-run-repeat with melee specs. I do not really see this being that large of a problem for any warrior specs atm. When a wizard is dotted root is not able to be used because it breaks when the dot hits you. When fighting a DK, a wizard will most likely be able to get off their first nuke, however the will most likely not be able to use root again. The range on decay is 7 blocks, making it fairly easy to get off during the fight. Once decay is applied root is not able to be used because the dot will always break it.

When fighting a sammy, the sammy will pop one and bleed the wizard, proceeding to smack the wizard repeatedly with a sword. Root is now useless because of the dot effect of bleed.

Dragoon easily has enough mobility to get out of the wizard cc, just by jumping when they get rooted.

When fighting a pally the most difficult part is not killing yourself by accident when they shield reflect. Paladins give wizards the least amount of trouble.

I have also played ninja this map. I only leveled to around level 28, but i had no trouble killing high level wizards (other than this one time when the person jumped in water). Melee specs such as ninja, even at a low level, stand a very good chance at killing a high level wizard as long as they don't jump out in the open right in front of the guy.

In conclusion i do not agree with any nerf to blink, but i do think that fireblast damage is a little too high.

Edit: Flameshield does absorb all of the damage from fireblast, i do not think it absorbs the initial fireball damage.

 

[cschris54321]

I'm not 100% sure but I don't think flameshield absorbs fireblast or the initial damage from fireball.

Even if it does the average fight for any melee will be:
Run at enemy -> get rooted -> icebolt, fireball, fireblast (-475ish hp) -> blink -> blink -> repeat

Blink is on too low of a cooldown for any melee class to have the hopes of catching up to a wizard (except bard with super jesus mode wtf permanent one and super jesus mode wtf aoe impale).

The other problem I have with wizards is the fact that they even have fireblast. Fireblast just seems like a skill that gets tagged onto a class simply because the class needs a little bit of free damage, and wizards seriously don't need it.

Suggestions:
-remove fireblast, wizards do not need it to do good damage and it fits pyro better anyway
OR
-raise CD of blink to like 15 seconds because seriously, why is a super high damage class with 2 slows also the second most mobile?

I agree with the fireblast nerf but keep the blink the same. Its is what makes them the best caster class 1v1, able to actually kite all of the mobile melee classes. Rouge classes can still kill a wizard and wizards can kill some/most warrior classes. (dks are a bitch with the long range dots)

 

[judgedread540]

When fighting a wizard my best advice would be to prevent them from icebolting you after they root you. Root breaks on damage and does not silence so it is quite easy to counter. My best advice would be to fireball them if they are out of fireblast or blaze range.

Also Diffuse, to answer your question wizards need high mobility to make up for them being so squishy and dealing with warmups. Wizards have around 60-160 lower hp max hp than all the other caster specs, and the only caster spec that has a warmup on a good portion on their skills. The combination of being the squishiest of all hero specs and being forced to apply slows to yourself to deal a good portion of your damage output.

On the point of cc-burst-run-repeat with melee specs. I do not really see this being that large of a problem for any warrior specs atm. When a wizard is dotted root is not able to be used because it breaks when the dot hits you. When fighting a DK, a wizard will most likely be able to get off their first nuke, however the will most likely not be able to use root again. The range on decay is 7 blocks, making it fairly easy to get off during the fight. Once decay is applied root is not able to be used because the dot will always break it.

When fighting a sammy, the sammy will pop one and bleed the wizard, proceeding to smack the wizard repeatedly with a sword. Root is now useless because of the dot effect of bleed.

Dragoon easily has enough mobility to get out of the wizard cc, just by jumping when they get rooted.

When fighting a pally the most difficult part is not killing yourself by accident when they shield reflect. Paladins give wizards the least amount of trouble.

I have also played ninja this map. I only leveled to around level 28, but i had no trouble killing high level wizards (other than this one time when the person jumped in water). Melee specs such as ninja, even at a low level, stand a very good chance at killing a high level wizard as long as they don't jump out in the open right in front of the guy.

In conclusion i do not agree with any nerf to blink, but i do think that fireblast damage is a little too high.

Edit: Flameshield does absorb all of the damage from fireblast, i do not think it absorbs the initial fireball damage.

It absorbs both of them, when you try and fireball or fireblast it would come up "judgedread540 resisted "fireball/fireblast".
Also i wasn't aware that any form of DoT stopped root, would this work for fire tick as well?

 

[jmoney222]

Dragoon easily has enough mobility to get out of the wizard cc, just by jumping when they get rooted.

You can't jump when you get rooted

 

[macura]

It absorbs both of them, when you try and fireball or fireblast it would come up "judgedread540 resisted "fireball/fireblast".
Also i wasn't aware that any form of DoT stopped root, would this work for fire tick as well?

I have broken root (i was rooted) by fireballing the other guy, not positive if the fire breaks root.
jmoney222 I'm not sure why you wouldn't be able to jump, people have used jump on me after i have rooted them. Root doesn't silence, that is piggify. You should still be able to use the skill, not sure what effect the slow of root does t0 jump when it is used though.

 

[judgedread540]

I have broken root (i was rooted) by fireballing the other guy, not positive if the fire breaks root.

I think that's just because when either the target or the caster takes damage it cancels the root.

 

[macura]

I think that's just because when either the target or the caster takes damage it cancels the root.

The root is broken when any damage hits the person who is rooted, i think that root might only break on skill damage to the caster, not just any type of damage.

 

[mikehk]

so now people are calling wizard weak because it can't beat a couple specs?
i will rework the suggestion to make it look more formal

 

[Haxnn]

People are not calling it weak, they are calling it balanced. Wizard does tons of damage but has to sacrafise it's protection. There are many ways to counter a wizard, but also many ways for a wizard to kill people.