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Suggestion Armor & Move Speed

spiralz

Obsidian
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
That moment you see a heavily armored player moving at you, closing the gap quickly as you prepare to be demolished.

What I am wondering is why armor does not slow a player down based on the type/amount of armor worn. For example, a quick and agile Ninja can be wearing near full iron armor (which doesn't make sense to begin with) and not take hinderance at all from this making them tanks. I believe that the more protection armor gives, the slower you should be able to move. Is the sacrifice of attribute points going into Endurance equal to the benefits of the armor you can wear? I don't believe so. Armor can negate a lot of damage whilst being able to attack and run freely as a player would without armor.

I think armor should slow the movement speed of the player wearing it depending on the type/amount of armor worn.
 

malikdanab

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Sep 28, 2011
That moment you see a heavily armored player moving at you, closing the gap quickly as you prepare to be demolished.

What I am wondering is why armor does not slow a player down based on the type/amount of armor worn. For example, a quick and agile Ninja can be wearing near full iron armor (which doesn't make sense to begin with) and not take hinderance at all from this making them tanks. I believe that the more protection armor gives, the slower you should be able to move. Is the sacrifice of attribute points going into Endurance equal to the benefits of the armor you can wear? I don't believe so. Armor can negate a lot of damage whilst being able to attack and run freely as a player would without armor.

I think armor should slow the movement speed of the player wearing it depending on the type/amount of armor worn.
I think a better union of lore and game mechanics would be that each class has a different base movement speed. On top of the already implemented base Agility stat, each class would have a different movement speed. For example:
Paladin 0.85 Movement Speed
Ninja 1.1 Movement Speed

Oh course this would require that classes would need to be balanced around these changes, but it would help fix some of the kiting problems we are having. It would also make agility a more viable classes that aren't (Ninja, Ranger, and Dragoon). So if a wizard wants to have higher armor and high movement speed they will have to sacrifice something. (Damage/Mana Regen)
 

Nukadokuu

Gold
Joined
Dec 5, 2012
I'm all for this, both ideas in a sense. Regardless of how it's done, something does need to be done about it. If I'm standing around in a chain shirt as a Disciple and I'm being outrun/being kept up with by a Ranger in almost full Iron, or a Paladin in diamond, there's a problem. It's bad enough I need basically every stat without having to dump 15 points into Endurance just to wear said chain shirt. (I understand that isn't too much for higher level characters, but at low levels that kills your capability to do damage, and then you're just dieing constantly)

I understand the concept of a Disciple is based on a Monk, who wear no armor and rely more on avoidance to fight toe-to-toe, but we don't really get that, do we? Perhaps a trade-off of some sort? I'd think the more agile classes like Disciple or Ninja would have next to no armor to start, but at least have some sort of benefit. A better move speed would be nice, but that doesn't help me go toe-to-toe against Paladins. My point is an alternative to armor for staying alive. My point is things like Monks, Ninjas, Ranger, and Casters are traditionally meant to not wear much armor, so why penalize them? If a Disciple gets such an atrociously low base equipment weight, and starts with a -5 Endurance, give us a good reason for it.

A miss chance or something? A deflection passive? Say a certain % based on how much armor you're wearing (Higher % for less armor obviously), scaling to level or something? Perhaps tie it into Agility?

So say you're a Ninja, you start with much lower base equipment weight (Currently 30 according to the Wiki, so let's drop it to 18.75, that of a Disciple for this example). Each point of Agility gives you a 1% chance for melee attacks to miss, or each point giving you a "deflection" bonus, reducing damage taken by your Agility bonus. Have this countered by how much armor somehow (Leather pieces reduce this by a certain % per piece, chain by more, and so on) so to make spending higher points in Endurance an option, but not a necessity.

30 Agility = 30% chance for attacks to miss, reduced by your % damage reduction from armor worn. Chain Helm = 8% reduction, thus reduces miss chance by 8% (Perhaps scale to 1.5% per agility point, reduction from armor remains)
or
30 agility = 90 damage from attacks is deflected (Agility X 3), reduced by your & damage reduction from armor worn. Chain Helm = 8% reduction, reducing deflection bonus by 8% to 82.8 (Perhaps tweak the multipliers or how much armor % reduces the Deflection)

Perhaps applying this to all classes would be nice, so a Paladin starting off benefits from it a little bit as well if he wants to spend a few points in Agility for the move speed. Thus classes with low equipment weights or that use Agility need less Endurance, but it might still help, while a class with higher endurance or base equipment weight get some benefit from spending points in Agility (Because let's face it, Disciples don't need the Stamina regen from Endurance that much, having high Endurance is almost entirely for armor)

Or just increase Disciple's Base Equipment Weight, that would help a lot. I'd simply be happy just being able to wear a Chain shirt at level 1, LIKE EVERY OTHER CLASS!! Why can a Wizard, Ninja, or Ranger do it, but not Disciples? If you look at Druids in the same "traditional" light as you do a Disciple, they shouldn't even be able to wear metal (Or maybe i just play too much Dungeons and Dragons)


Anyways, This is all just off the top of my head, and might sound ridiculous or overpowered, idk. My end point is if my class is based on being agile and flexible. I just don't want crap like this to -continue- to happen;
A. I'm screwed in fights because I get no armor and have to spend my points in basically every stat.
B. I can't deal damage or heal with any abilities because I spent all my points in Endurance so i can have the same armor everyone else starts with
C. I'm outrun by Paladins because I don't want to dump all my points into Agility, because I can't even use a bow
 

mikehk

Legacy Supporter 6
Joined
Aug 17, 2012
Location
Idaho
i agree with malik, things would have to be rebalanced. starting with ninjas having less health...
 

malikdanab

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Sep 28, 2011
Side Note- The reason that class such as ninja are considered as "OP" as they are this map is due to the way PVP has been going. Currently, it's rare to see big team battles. Most fight don't consist of more than 3 people per team. Due to this, Assassin classes are excelling in their 1v1 nature. In a real team fight, a ninja would have a much hard time surviving all the AOE dmg.

I'm not saying they aren't OP (THEY ARE!) it's just adds to the feeling.
 

Xargun

Legacy Supporter 9
Joined
Jan 12, 2013
Location
Ohio, USA
I would love to see armor weight affect speed. If adding some classes a higher base speed that would be fine too. Or if possible perhaps some modifier by class - a ninja or wizard were iron armor should be super slow compared to a paladin or dreadknight wearing it. Maybe go back to the 'ideal' armor for each class and if you go higher you get speed penalties ? So wizards should wear leather, but if they wear chain then they lose a % of their total movement speed. Maybe this will help farmers with leather sales too.
 

malikdanab

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Sep 28, 2011
I would love to see armor weight affect speed. If adding some classes a higher base speed that would be fine too. Or if possible perhaps some modifier by class - a ninja or wizard were iron armor should be super slow compared to a paladin or dreadknight wearing it. Maybe go back to the 'ideal' armor for each class and if you go higher you get speed penalties ? So wizards should wear leather, but if they wear chain then they lose a % of their total movement speed. Maybe this will help farmers with leather sales too.
What I've been thinking is that (In addition to base movement speeds)all classes should have lower equipment weight. The reason for this is that, classes would able to exceed their maximum weight, but include the previously suggested "burdened" status. So while a wizard COULD wear full diamond, they wouldn't be able to move quickly/at all. The rate at which you would be slowed would be a thing to balance, but I'm thinking something like X speed for every % weight over your maximum. On the flip side, you'd gain speed for having higher max weight than the armor you are wearing (Waiting for the day naked Zerker is viable...)

Example:

Berserker with 24 End has 65 weight (All iron but helm)
  • 75/65 = (115.3% - 100%) * 0.75 = 86.5% move speed
  • 55/65 = (118.1% -100%) * 0.75 = 113.5% move speed
Note- The numbers are just for explanation sake. This would probably be op with naked classes gaining 75% speed boost
 
Last edited:

spiralz

Obsidian
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
What I've been thinking is that (In addition to base movement speeds)all classes should have lower equipment weight. The reason for this is that, classes would able to exceed their maximum weight, but include the previously suggested "burdened" status. So while a wizard COULD wear full diamond, they wouldn't be able to move quickly/at all. The rate at which you would be slowed would be a thing to balance, but I'm thinking something like X speed for every % weight over your maximum. On the flip side, you'd gain speed for having higher max weight than the armor you are wearing (Waiting for the day naked Zerker is viable...)

Example:

Berserker with 24 End has 65 weight (All iron but helm)
  • 75/65 = (115.3% - 100%) * 0.75 = 86.5% move speed
  • 55/65 = (118.1% -100%) * 0.75 = 113.5% move speed
Note- The numbers are just for explanation sake. This would probably be op with naked classes gaining 75% speed boost

What if being over-encumbered simply removed their ability to sprint?
 

malikdanab

Legacy Supporter 8
Joined
Sep 28, 2011
What if being over-encumbered simply removed their ability to sprint?
Cause thats a flat 25% speed nerf. So even if you are 0.1 weight over, you will be moving 25% slower. And the flip side, a Wizard could have FULL diamond and only be slowed 25%
 
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