A hiccup somewhere along the way

[Egorh]

I decided to go back to Disciple and I realized something immediately. The armor weight was decreased.

• 20 -> 16.25

There was not talk of this nerf in the forums, I did not find a change implemented in the Git, and when I downloaded the .zip from the Git it said Disciple's base armor weight was 20. If this was purposely implemented it was not needed. Disciple took a pretty large hit from the documented nerfs but this brings it over the top.

@Kainzo

 

[Kainzo]

Discs should be a "no to low" armor class.

 

[Egorh]

Discs should be a "no to low" armor class.

When it had 20 base armor weight it was still the lowest of the all the classes (next would be runeblade at 25). As I said before, this change along with all the rest is too large of a hit. If you really insist it have this low of armor weight it is going to need to be heavily compensated elsewhere.

 

[Irishman81]

The majority of disciples wear 40 armor weight, and now having the mana issues, the class is going to be ripped apart by warriors, even with barrier. I agree that it should be put back to the normal weight, or get an increase in base health.

 

[Kainzo]

The majority of disciples wear 40 armor weight, and now having the mana issues, the class is going to be ripped apart by warriors, even with barrier. I agree that it should be put back to the normal weight, or get an increase in base health.

When it had 20 base armor weight it was still the lowest of the all the classes (next would be runeblade at 25). As I said before, this change along with all the rest is too large of a hit. If you really insist it have this low of armor weight it is going to need to be heavily compensated elsewhere.

Since it wasnt a discussed change, we can go ahead and add it back.

@Balance Team

 

[Egorh]

@malikdanab mr.implementer

 

[malikdanab]

Disciple's weight is still 20. The reason it starts off at 16.25 is because it has -5 endurance.

 

[Egorh]

Disciple's weight is still 20. The reason it starts off at 16.25 is because it has -5 endurance.

If base now starts at 0 I guess that would explain it, but that must be a new change with attributes. I don't remember reading anything about this change. When I think base I think of what the class starts with (not necessarily 0)

 

[Egorh]

I decided to do some looking to see what else got hit by the attribute change (the base armor weight it now corresponding with a stat at 0 instead of the base stats) All information retrieved from the wiki and the visions server

• Disciple (at -5 endurance)
  • 20 -> 16.25
• Cleric (at 5 endurance)
  • 40 -> 43.75
• Druid (at 5 endurance)
  • 26.25 -> 30
• Bloodmage (at 5 endurance)
  • 26.25 -> 30

• Shaman (at 3 endurance)

• 31.25 -> 33.5

• Wizard (at -3 endurance)
  • 26.25 -> 24
• Pyromancer (at -3 endurance)
  • 33.75 -> 31.5
• Necromancer (at -3 endurance)
  • 30 -> 27.75
• Beguiler (at -3 endurance)
  • 26.25 -> 24

• Ninja (at 2 endurance)
  • 30 -> 31.5
• Ranger (at 5 endurance)
  • 32 -> 35.75
• Runeblade (at 2 endurance)
  • 25 -> 26.5
• Bard (at 0 endurance)
  • 35 -> 35

• Berserker (at 3 endurance)
  • 40 -> 42.25
• Paladin (at 7 endurance)
  • 55 -> 60.25
• Dreadknight (at 6 endurance)
  • 53 -> 57.5
• Dragoon (at 4 endurance)
  • 50 -> 53

It seems that every class except for Bard (Bard's base endurance is 0) was either buffed or nerfed according to their base endurance. It is treating zero as the base instead of the actual base stat so this is what happens: BaseArmorWeight + 0.75 * Endurance = ArmorWeight.

• Disciple Example: 20 + 0.75 * -5 = 16.25
• Paladin Example: 55 + 0.75 * 7 = 60.25

These are pretty big changes that we had no idea about. In some cases it really hurts the class (the classes that already have a low base armor weight and negative endurance. Eg Disciple), and in others it over buffs the class (the classes with high base endurance. Eg Paladin).

I do not know what overall attribute change was implemented but it should be reverted as soon as possible. It does not just apply to the armor weight:

Health -- At level 1 (the visions server was setting me at level 1, not max level)

• Paladin (at 6 constitution)
  • 630 -> 676
• Wizard (at -5 constitution)
  • 520 -> 481

Mana -- At level 1 (the visions server was setting me at level 1, not max level)

• Wizard (at 10 intellect)
  • 914 -> 965
• Berserker (at -6 intellect)
  • 340 -> 310

Those are also fairly strong health and mana changes

@Kainzo

 

[malikdanab]

If base now starts at 0 I guess that would explain it, but that must be a new change with attributes. I don't remember reading anything about this change. When I think base I think of what the class starts with (not necessarily 0)

Base values are always without attributes. It has never changed.

 

[Egorh]

Base values are always without attributes. It has never changed.

Well, I may be wrong but something must've changed. Otherwise Disciple's armor would not take 27 endurance to wear 40. Before any of the patches I think it was 23 endurance to get 40 armor weight